Joe Biden has shifted left

jacksonsprat22 said:
Absolutely.
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Well that's a good thing for public relations and it certainly will not interfere with the agenda of Biden’s donors now will it? But if he ever dares to step on the toes of their profit margins in favor of the people's needs, they will smack him back into yesterday. And that is how much Biden gives a crap about you and yours and me and mine and representative of who and what really runs this town and for whose benefit.

Joe Biden says he plans to deal with the US health care crisis by passing a public health insurance option. But his campaign is being funded by the same health companies that killed it when he was vice president. Something has to give — and it probably won't be the corporate donors.
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2020/07/joe-biden-public-option-single-payer-health-company-donations
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jacksonsprat22 said:
Trump is a fascist...
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jacksonsprat22 said:
Don't agree at all.
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He’s right.

Biden is going to need the working class vote and the lawlessness that’s been allowed to go on by Democrats isn’t the way to appeal to the working class.

The parallels between now and the late 60’s is striking. Lots of racial unrest [it was a tad more justified then]; Robert Kennedy was one of the leaders in the democrat primaries until he was assassinated. MLK was shot in April of ‘68. Anti-war protests were going on on college campuses and some of them were even shot and killed at Kent State.

Maybe this isn’t the most tumultuous time in recent history after all.

But because of all the unrest and the fact Nixon ran on law and order he defeated Hubert Humphrey in November of 1968.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
The "violent mobs" were demanding justice and many states changed the way they police. Most Americans are sympathetic.

Trump is a fascist and hardly representing the temperament of the people as "moderate centrism."
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Americans are sympathetic about the issue of police misconduct. Peaceful protesters were demanding justice, not the violence and looting; besides, because you think their cause is just does not mean most Americans did not oppose the violence and recoiled from that aspect of the demonstrations.

Calling someone a fascist is just hyperbole and does not address the question. If Biden and the Democrats are moving to the left and the country is 72% moderate and conservative, that takes away voters needed to defeat Trump. Despite public dislike he might be viewed as a safer alternative for most of the moderate voters.

You are trying to defend the liberal positions while I am only talking about public opinion and reactions to events.
 
Flash said:
Americans are sympathetic about the issue of police misconduct. Peaceful protesters were demanding justice, not the violence and looting; besides, because you think their cause is just does not mean most Americans did not oppose the violence and recoiled from that aspect of the demonstrations.

Calling someone a fascist is just hyperbole and does not address the question. If Biden and the Democrats are moving to the left and the country is 72% moderate and conservative, that takes away voters needed to defeat Trump. Despite public dislike he might be viewed as a safer alternative for most of the moderate voters.

You are trying to defend the liberal positions while I am only talking about public opinion and reactions to events.
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I just don't agree with anything you said. America is not conservative. You are projecting.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
Biden is happily inheriting a party that has moved to the left, without interruption, since he left the vice presidency. The report this week from his Unity Task Force, the product of a deal between the nominee and primary runner-up Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.), found Biden's team inching a little further in that direction — cautious, careful with its wording, but dramatically different from the politics that defined much of Biden's career.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...litics1-8-12_trailer-810am:homepage/story-ans
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Yep, and it may cost him the election.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
I just don't agree with anything you said. America is not conservative. You are projecting.
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I am projecting nothing, I was just citing Gallup poll surveys which basically support other studies. Only 24% identify as liberal.

However, more people identify as Democratic (30%) than Republican (28%) but most call themselves independent (41%). People cannot vote independent and most of the independents regularly vote Democratic or Republican. Only about 10% are truly independent.

I think you are too optimistic about Americans moving far to the left because you share that belief. I have noticed from this forum that most liberals and conservatives are overly optimistic about their party. They are sure they are going to run away with the next election and that voters support all their causes. Liberals were convinced every new negative news story about Trump was going to end his presidency (taxes, emoluments, impeachment, Mueller report, etc.). Also, people (especially liberals) seem to think major changes are coming quickly although they never really occur. Change tends to occur rather slowly and both parties are very resilient. When one party is badly defeated in an election we read about that party being "dead" only to come back and win the next election.
 
Flash said:
I am projecting nothing, I was just citing Gallup poll surveys which basically support other studies. Only 24% identify as liberal.

However, more people identify as Democratic (30%) than Republican (28%) but most call themselves independent (41%). People cannot vote independent and most of the independents regularly vote Democratic or Republican. Only about 10% are truly independent.

I think you are too optimistic about Americans moving far to the left because you share that belief. I have noticed from this forum that most liberals and conservatives are overly optimistic about their party. They are sure they are going to run away with the next election and that voters support all their causes. Liberals were convinced every new negative news story about Trump was going to end his presidency (taxes, emoluments, impeachment, Mueller report, etc.). Also, people (especially liberals) seem to think major changes are coming quickly although they never really occur. Change tends to occur rather slowly and both parties are very resilient. When one party is badly defeated in an election we read about that party being "dead" only to come back and win the next election.
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You have no idea what my politics are. The boogeyman of Marxist Leftism is dumb. Sorry, Trump is a fascist. We are done with that.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
No one is clean. But Trump is only the third President to be impeached. And Clinton was impeached in his second term when he could not run again.
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But Clinton probably would have won a third term if he had been allowed to run.

Trump obviously isn't as popular, but incumbents rarely lose the presidency.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
You have no idea what my politics are. The boogeyman of Marxist Leftism is dumb. Sorry, Trump is a fascist. We are done with that.
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I said nothing about Marxist Leftism. You are making wild, unwarranted assumptions. I only mentioned liberals and conservatives.

But you are right about boogeymen. The socialist, communist, or fascist labels are just hyperbole designed to engender hate.
 
jacksonsprat22 said:
Trump would have to declare martial law to stay in power. His corruption is obvious. But he is grossly incompetent.
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The fact that he hasn't declared martial law shows that he isn't as authoritarian as people claim he is. He's actually been good about allowing federalism to proceed. States are supposed to handle most things.
 
Woko Haram said:
The fact that he hasn't declared martial law shows that he isn't as authoritarian as people claim he is. He's actually been good about allowing federalism to proceed. States are supposed to handle most things.
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States don't go to war or solve a pandemic. If Trump doesn't want to be President he should resign.
 
Trump shifted so far to the right, that Biden appears to be shifting left. Biden is criticized by the left for using the old fashioned politics he was steeped in , in a world that has changed from those times. The Dems do not love Biden, but they know America needs to be saved from the incompetent buffoon in office.
 
Nordberg said:
Trump shifted so far to the right, that Biden appears to be shifting left. Biden is criticized by the left for using the old fashioned politics he was steeped in , in a world that has changed from those times. The Dems do not love Biden, but they know America needs to be saved from the incompetent buffoon in office.
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Trump is actually less conservative in economics than a lot of the most recent Republican presidents. He might be more socially conservative on a few things, but for example, being supportive of immigration controls was originally something that Democrats were ok with. Bill Clinton would have to run as a Republican today if he ran on his 1996 platform.

Society overall has shifted pretty far to the left on social issues, and this is largely due to the extremism of social media coming out of Silicon Valley.
 
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