๐—ช๐—ต๐—ฎ๐˜'๐˜€ ๐—ต๐—ฎ๐—ฝ๐—ฝ๐—ฒ๐—ป๐—ฒ๐—ฑ ๐˜๐—ผ ๐—ผ๐˜‚๐—ฟ ๐—ฝ๐—ฟ๐—ฒ๐˜€๐—ฒ๐—ป๐—ฐ๐—ฒ ๐—ถ๐—ป ๐˜๐—ต๐—ฒ ๐— ๐—˜ ๐˜‚๐—ป๐—ฑ๐—ฒ๐—ฟ ๐˜๐—ฟ๐˜‚๐—บ๐—ฝ ๐—ฎ๐—ป๐—ฑ ๐—ž๐—ฒ๐—ด๐—ฏ๐—ฟ๐—ฒ๐—ฎ๐˜๐—ต....

Trump and Hegseth are not the ones who over many decades built the infrastructure that is undefendable.....America has something like 800 bases outside of America, they all have the same problem.

The Empire massively fucked up.
To be fair though:
1) having a lot of outposts makes military intelligence operations around the world much easier to manage, and you can't really run intelligence operations out of monster-buildings with "TRUMP" or 'Murica" painted on them.
2) Investing a lot of time and money on expensive bases in the ME, where there is so much political instability, isn't necessarily a great idea. Look at that monstrosity of an airport that the Russians built in Afghanistan: Bagram. Russia's enemies have traded that base back and forth for generations now.
IMO it's probably not worth building a great number of bases in the ME that you're not comfortable putting a match to on a moment's notice.

Further to #1, maybe the biggest negative to come from this war will be America's diminished military intelligence operation capabilities in the ME as a result of closing so many bases. I'm just spitballing though.
 
mUch dRUnK?

That paragraph was actually just gobbledygook.

That's got everything to do with the islamization of Turkey, and their subsequent drifting away from NATO, than what has transpired between America and Iran.

Turkey is on the road to being more of an enemy than a friend. I don't think that they will be in NATO for very long.

What you did there was identify a geopolitical event and then frame it's cause around your own bullshit narrative. "Sumfing not gud happind so it wuz Twumpy fawt".

FYI Pakistan and India have been close to war for a while now, and Pakistan remembers the people who rejoiced with them when they were slaughtering hundreds of thousands of Sikhs and Hindus in 1947. This alliance has more to do with Pakistan's evil than anything else.

You're a really sick, stupid piece of shit, QP!

There are just a handful of adults in the western world who actually believe what you just wrote there, and their IQs are all in the mid-to-low dbl digits.
There was a time when the Turks wanted to be considered European.....but Europe spent decades claiming they wanted it so even as they never pursued it....the words from Europe were yes as the behavior was no.

Now the Turks are done with that, I heard Scott Ritter say the other day that Turkey has long now been NATO in name only.
 
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To be fair though:
1) having a lot of outposts makes military intelligence operations around the world much easier to manage, and you can't really run intelligence operations out of monster-buildings with "TRUMP" or 'Murica" painted on them.
2) Investing a lot of time and money on expensive bases in the ME, where there is so much political instability, isn't necessarily a great idea. Look at that monstrosity of an airport that the Russians built in Afghanistan: Bagram. Russia's enemies have traded that base back and forth for generations now.
IMO it's probably not worth building a great number of bases in the ME that you're not comfortable putting a match to on a moment's notice.

Further to #1, maybe the biggest negative to come from this war will be America's diminished military intelligence operation capabilities in the ME as a result of closing so many bases. I'm just spitballing though.
America has a 20th century military in the 21st century.....warfare has completely changed.....advances in missile tech has made these bases targets and America's failure to keep up with air defense makes keeping them all wasted effort and expense.

America has pulled this shit over and over again, for instance investing so much in carriers when carriers are obsolete, and building huge expensive drones which are fat targets.....vast swarms of small cheap drones is the winning play.

Calcified is a great word for what happened to America's military.....why it now keeps getting its ass kicked....it happened because the main purpose of America's defense industry is wealth extraction not producing quality gear.....and the Generals are focused on their post military career in the defense industry where they get gobs of wealth, so they do nothing about the problem....they would be punished for speaking up.....for telling the nation that we are on the wrong track.
 
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The view is controversial but Ted Postol is currently running around saying that he has looked at the evidence.....the truth is that the Patriot System is almost completely useless.

I am pretty sure he does not think much better of the Thaad system.
 
As for proven quality air defense the Russians are the only ones who have it, but since they and the Chinese are now blood brothers we have to assume they do as well. The Iranian air defenses have proved to be very good, though it is unclear how much their systems have been fortified with Russian and Chinese gear.
 
Nomad, you're actually trying to prove that this war was legitimate with your BS, dummy.

If Iran was able to mount such a strong defence, and caused such widespread damage, that would prove that they were almost at the point where they were unassailable with conventional weapons, and could start making nukes with impunity.
So by your idiotic logic, if some country attacks the US based on the fact that we are able to mount such a strong defense, and cause widespread damage, it would be a legitimate act of war on their part.

Really? :palm:

And your moronic assumption that Iran having a robust conventional weapons capability somehow increases their propensity for advancement of their nuclear program is so dopey I have no words for it.

Congratulations.
But, truth be told, your post was still BS.

FYI when the war broke out, the US moved their personnel to their most highly defended bases, to protect them. As a result, there are more buildings that are substantially damaged than there are US servicemen dead. From Grok:
  • Early in the conflict (starting late February 2026), many bases were partially or largely evacuated because they were judged too vulnerable for normal staffing levels. Operations shifted toward dispersed or remote modes in places.
So you're admitting that what I posted was correct.

Because trump started an unnecessary military action to distract attention from his sex scandals, we have fewer military resources in the hottest conflict zone on Earth.

Way to go, Orange Oaf.
As always, Trump has prioritized the lives of his servicemen and women above all else. Some buildings are gone, but very few people.
Yeah, tell that to the crew of the USS Abraham Lincoln.

Especially the ones who would rather jump overboard rather than live in the hell he and Kegbreath have created for those service people they have "prioritized".
A lot of what you're counting as destroyed buildings, open bases, etc, that the US used to have, that are now empty or damaged, weren't fully "war ready" bases, they were just outposts.
And a lot of them were fully "war ready" bases, and not just outposts.

Your excuse making is shameless.
 
America has a 20th century military in the 21st century.....warfare has completely changed.....advances in missile tech has made these bases targets and America's failure to keep up with air defense makes keeping them all wasted effort and expense.
I think that's the reason they closed so many bases.

Putting up that many air defences all over the place would cost an astronomical amount of money. In addition to all the radar installations, each system would need its own stockpile of missiles and it's too much.

America's air defences are in the middle of a huge upgrade to lasers, which don't have the same reloading and speed issues.
America has pulled this shit over and over again, for instance investing so much in carriers when carriers are obsolete, and building huge expensive drones which are fat targets.....vast swarms of small cheap drones is the winning play.
They're not really obsolete if they're still working, and I'd hazard a guess that the presence of 2 carrier task forces off the coast of Lebanon (under the Biden administration, initially) is what prevented Hezbollah from unleashing hell at the same time as Hamas was sending their rocket barrages over.

They are huge, expensive sitting ducks though, and it's hard to imagine that they will continue to remain untouchable for generations to come. The cost of protecting them from subs, ultra-long-range missiles, etc is prohibitive, and even then, underwater nukes don't have to be very close to trigger a wave that will wreck them.
Calcified is a great word for what happened to America's military.....why it now keeps getting its ass kicked....it happened because the main purpose of America's defense industry is wealth extraction not producing quality gear.....and the Generals are focused on their post military career in the defense industry where they get gobs of wealth, so they do nothing about the problem....they would be punished for speaking up.....for telling the nation that we are on the wrong track.
It seems like America's gear throttles the Russian and Chinese gear that Iran deployed against them, but I dunno about the long-term possibility of staying ahead of China, tech-wise.

There are a lot of Chinese in America studying in America's top universities, but there are no Americans studying over there afaik.
 
I think that's the reason they closed so many bases.

Putting up that many air defences all over the place would cost an astronomical amount of money. In addition to all the radar installations, each system would need its own stockpile of missiles and it's too much.

America's air defences are in the middle of a huge upgrade to lasers, which don't have the same reloading and speed issues.

They're not really obsolete if they're still working, and I'd hazard a guess that the presence of 2 carrier task forces off the coast of Lebanon (under the Biden administration, initially) is what prevented Hezbollah from unleashing hell at the same time as Hamas was sending their rocket barrages over.

They are huge, expensive sitting ducks though, and it's hard to imagine that they will continue to remain untouchable for generations to come. The cost of protecting them from subs, ultra-long-range missiles, etc is prohibitive, and even then, underwater nukes don't have to be very close to trigger a wave that will wreck them.

It seems like America's gear throttles the Russian and Chinese gear that Iran deployed against them, but I dunno about the long-term possibility of staying ahead of China, tech-wise.

There are a lot of Chinese in America studying in America's top universities, but there are no Americans studying over there afaik.
Sure America might get functional air defenses at some point but we are not there yet....and the American defense industry has a long record of producing very expensive low quality.

The Empire never was able to take out Irans air defenses, which is why it was forced to use mostly stand off weapons which it is rapidly running out of, which will take years to resupply best case, which is doubtful with China's strangle hold on rare earths.
 
So by your idiotic logic, if some country attacks the US based on the fact that we are able to mount such a strong defense, and cause widespread damage, it would be a legitimate act of war on their part.
That's just stupid, nomad.

You have a kindergarten-level of understanding of this topic.

Historically, countries that have enemies and a window of opportunity to defeat said enemies either seize the opportunity or learn a very hard lesson involving thousands and thousands of local deaths.

If Iran got that window if opportunity in the ME, 10M Israelis would be dead. Not just 70,000 or whatever.

America had a window of opportunity to defeat Iran for a long time and did nothing with it, but the window was swiftly closing, and America struck because they had to... A nuclear-armed IRGC would be a global catastrophe far beyond your reckoning.

This isn't like an old battle between England and France, where victory for either side only determined which french-speaking King inherited a bit of extra territory for the next 20 years. It's like putting down and existential threat.

Defeating the IRGC isn't a political victory, it's an imperative.

Stop letting CNN and the Demonrats do your thinking for you, and cheer for an American victory, regardless of how you feel about "owanje-man".
 
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Sure America might get functional air defenses at some point but we are not there yet....and the American defense industry has a long record of producing very expensive low quality.

The Empire never was able to take out Irans air defenses, which is why it was forced to use mostly stand off weapons which it is rapidly running out of, which will take years to resupply best case, which is doubtful with China's strangle hold on rare earths.
I think that the heavy reliance on stand-off weapons has more to do with keeping the US servicemen body count down than their ability to operate within Iranian airspace.

Trump also can't afford to give the Dems the propaganda victory that would go along with the downing of an F22 or F35. Trump is fighting this war on two fronts.
 
I think that the heavy reliance on stand-off weapons has more to do with keeping the US servicemen body count down than their ability to operate within Iranian airspace.

Trump also can't afford to give the Dems the propaganda victory that would go along with the downing of an F22 or F35. Trump is fighting this war on two fronts.
You are wrong.
 
I fail to see why the USA needs any bases in the Middle East.


They are costing us lots, and are simply expensive static targets for relative cheap weaponry, as well as being a security risk and a danger to military personnel thus exposed to attack. Modern warfare is moving away from the old patterns at warp speed.


Static, concentrated targets in an era of cheap precision weapons. Large fixed bases such as Al Udeid (Qatar, ~10,000 personnel, CENTCOM forward HQ), Naval Support Activity Bahrain (Fifth Fleet HQ), Camp Arifjan and related sites in Kuwait, and Al Dhafra (UAE) sit well within range of Iranian ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, and drones.


Flight times from Iranian launch points are measured in minutes.



During the recent fighting, these facilities took repeated hits: runways, hangars, radars, command nodes, and support infrastructure were damaged. Aircraft were destroyed or disabled on the ground. Casualties occurred. Billions in repair and replacement costs mounted. Air and missile defenses intercepted many projectiles but could not stop everything, and interceptor stockpiles are finite and expensive.


Cheap attritable systems favor the attacker in volume.


Cost and exposure. Maintaining tens of thousands of personnel (recent estimates in the 40,000โ€“50,000 range across the broader region, many rotational) plus the infrastructure, logistics, and force-protection overhead is expensive. Host-nation contributions (Qatarโ€™s heavy investment in Al Udeid, for example) offset some of it, but the U.S. still bears significant recurring costs in personnel, operations, and contingency response. More importantly, the personnel themselves become hostages to geography and escalation dynamics.


Mismatch with modern warfare trends. Distributed operations, long-range precision strike from standoff platforms, undersea forces, space and cyber capabilities, and attritable unmanned systems reduce the relative value of large, permanent forward bases optimized for the post-Cold War, post-9/11 environment.

The โ€œAmerican way of warโ€ that relied on sanctuary at forward bases has been eroded.


The Pentagon is actively studying a smaller, more dispersed, or westward-shifted posture once the immediate Iran fighting subsides.


Options under discussion include:


  • Reducing or eliminating the most exposed Gulf bases (Kuwait sites, parts of the Qatar footprint, etc.).
  • Greater reliance on naval presence (submarines, surface combatants operating farther out) and rotational air deployments rather than permanent large garrisons.
  • Hardening, dispersal, and rapid runway repair at remaining sites, plus more investment in counter-drone and directed-energy defenses.
  • Shifting some residual presence toward partners farther from Iranian missile arcs (Jordan, or deeper cooperation with Israel) or emphasizing โ€œsecurity integratorโ€ rolesโ€”helping partners defend themselves rather than serving as the primary tripwire.

A pure โ€œzero optionโ€ (complete withdrawal of land bases and significant naval drawdown) has advocates in restraint-oriented circles.


It would eliminate the static-target problem and free resources, and force supposed "allies" to hedge more aggressively toward China, Russia, or Iran.


Pure status-quo retention looks increasingly indefensible on cost, risk, and opportunity-cost grounds.
 
Trump also can't afford to give the Dems the propaganda victory that would go along with the downing of an F22 or F35. Trump is fighting this war on two fronts.

Trump isn't running.

The GOP currently in office has so far failed to even secure our elections, so I I were he, I wouldn't lose any sleep over their chances in November.

Let the Democrats fixate on the lame duck POTUS. He's drawing their fire, and that's not a bad tactic, IMO.
 
Trump isn't running.

The GOP currently in office has so far failed to even secure our elections, so I I were he, I wouldn't lose any sleep over their chances in November.

Let the Democrats fixate on the lame duck POTUS. He's drawing their fire, and that's not a bad tactic, IMO.
1) Trump cares almost as much about the upcoming mid-terms as he did the last election
2) Trump also cares about the future of the GOP after he leaves. Anyone with an IQ over 75 wants Rubio or Vance to be the next POTUS, instead of whatever braindead douchebag the Dems barf up.
 
1) Trump cares almost as much about the upcoming mid-terms as he did the last election

The GOP Senators currently in office have so far failed to even secure our elections, so if I were he, I wouldn't lose any sleep over their chances in November. He owes the party nothing, IMO.

2) Trump also cares about the future of the GOP after he leaves.

I don't know where you got that idea.

Anyone with an IQ over 75 wants Rubio or Vance to be the next POTUS, instead of whatever braindead douchebag the Dems barf up.

I agree that voting against the worst choice is preferable to doing nothing.
 
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