When was that and what was more democratic about it?
The insanity and stupidity of the undemocratic Electoral College explained
- Thread starter Cinnabar
- Start date
When was that and what was more democratic about it?
cawacko
Well-known member
Actually reading this board should give one less faith in democracy. I’m not talking a right/left thing here but an attitude of such dislike and almost outright hate, across the political spectrum, for those who don’t vote like we want and what people want done to them in terms of rights etc. Whatever the name of it is it’s not democracy
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
I'll answer that if you can tell me, in you own opinion, "When was America great?"
Can you explain, in your own words, what is meant by "Making America Great AGAIN?
I never said anything about making America great again--it is a campaign slogan which never mean anything. You did say "let's get back to democracy."
cawacko
Well-known member
Admittedly, I was interested in hearing your opinion/response to the question about democracy. What does your second paragraph have to do with being able to answer that question?
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
OK! Is the name United STates a farce then? Are we truly United?
The Federal Government has no power to tell states how to run their own state and local elections.
But, if we are truly United, we must be united in the way states vote in FEDERAL ELECTIONS!
We can't have states voting differently from state to state in Federal elections making up their own rules as they go along.
That is the insanity of the Delegation process! It is undemocratic!
Do we tell states- Your votes do not count? NO!
Then why do we keep telling individuals that their votes do not count?
Every States votes should count!
And every voter's vote should count as well!
We can't play party favorites- or set up the way states vote to give a political party an unfair advantage!
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Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
You are the one that has a problem with me saying the word "again"?
Well, I have a question about your use of the word, when using it to say, "MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN".
You ask me when were we ever a democracy?
I ask you to tell me when we were great?
You answer me, and I'll answer you!
Being democratic allows each state to determine how its electoral votes will be chosen just as the Constitution specifies based on the wishes of each state.
Everybody's vote already does count. All of our non-presidential elections are winner-take-all. The person with the most votes wins and the voters of the other party win nothing.
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
No! You are right! It is not a democracy!
My question to you is- and please be clear- DO YOU WANT AMERICA TO BE A FREE DEMOCRACY OR NOT?
cawacko
Well-known member
I have no problems at all here. I was interested in hearing your opinion on the question. You don’t want to answer it. Fair enough.
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
Sorry, but there is nothing about the delegation process that is DEMOCRATIC in any sense of the word!
You are flat out wrong about that!
cawacko
Well-known member
My lawyer response is how are you defining those terms? Because ten people could have ten different meanings for what they think a free democracy is
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
How can America be a voice for Democracy in the world when we do not even elect our own presidents in a Democratic way?
While we would like to see free elections in every country but let's take IRAN for example. If IRAN decided to go the American way and allowed their clerics and zealots to become the delegates that actually determines the votes- Would that be a free democratic election? Isn't that what they have now for heaven's sake?
I hate to have to say it, but that is the way we do it here! That's "3rd world" people! Wake up!!
That's not democracy! That's not a free election! And we are no better than IRAN is now when it comes to the way we put leaders into office.
That's why IRAN laughs at us, because they select their leaders no different than in the way we select our leaders today!
While we would like to see free elections in every country but let's take IRAN for example. If IRAN decided to go the American way and allowed their clerics and zealots to become the delegates that actually determines the votes- Would that be a free democratic election? Isn't that what they have now for heaven's sake?
I hate to have to say it, but that is the way we do it here! That's "3rd world" people! Wake up!!
That's not democracy! That's not a free election! And we are no better than IRAN is now when it comes to the way we put leaders into office.
That's why IRAN laughs at us, because they select their leaders no different than in the way we select our leaders today!
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What do you mean by "delegation process"? It is certainly more democratic than the first presidential elections when there were no popular votes.
The Constitution was not written to be democratic. How is winner-take-all for presidential elections any less democratic than for all other elections?
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
I am going to say this, and I am going to say this right now...
The first time a Republican nominee loses an election after winning the popular vote.................
You hypicrital bastards will be calling for an end to the Delegation process!
It just hasn't happened yet- BUT IT WILL!
The first time a Republican nominee loses an election after winning the popular vote.................
You hypicrital bastards will be calling for an end to the Delegation process!
It just hasn't happened yet- BUT IT WILL!
Agreed. Neither side will admit they use the same double standards and same methods as the other.
I am still interested in knowing: 1) when was the U. S. more of a democracy 2) what is the delegation process 3) why is winner-take-all for president any different than for all other elections?
Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
OK! Let's say you have 3 children, and you tell them you are planning for next years vacation, and they have a choice, "Do you want to go to Disneyland in Florida, or camping in the Colorado Rocky Mountains?
Two kids immediately say, "Disneyland dad"! One kid say's, "Camping dad"!
As a father, would you then say, "OK, It's decided, we are going camping"! Would that be democratic? Don't think so!
Shouldn't a majority always win? You know it, and I know it! The answer is yes!
And how would your two kids that wanted to go to Disneyland feel? Do you think after by playing and going by the rules and voted, do you think they would be disgruntled and feel like they were treated unfairly! Justifyingly so!
Well, that is how the majority of voters feel when they win the popular vote and are told they lost the election!
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Adolf_Twitler
Verified User
OK, the Electoral process is a delegation process! So I am not sure why that seems to be hanging you up! Are you playing semantics with me?
And the truth is, our electoral process has never been a democratic process! And that is what is hanging me up! Because our electoral process should be a democratic process!
Into the Night
Contributor
There are not 3 million members of the Electoral College. They didn't vote for Hillary anyway.
Yes. Utterly. I absolutely detest democracy. It is destructive. It is mob rule. It is unstable. It decays into dictatorships and oligarchies. I will do anything I can to stop democracy from coming to the United States. There is a reason there are no democracies anywhere in the world today.
I support a republic. It has a constitution. I support the United States. It is a federated republic.
Into the Night
Contributor
How?