Then why hasn't it been done? This thread is 4 months old.
The End For Electric Cars? VW Develops New Hydrogen Tech: 2,000 Km On A Single Tank
- Thread starter cancel2 2022
- Start date
Then why hasn't it been done? This thread is 4 months old.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
Actually, at some point fuel cell cars, be it on hydrogen, anhydrous ammonia, or something else, will bury battery cars. Battery cars have always ended up a niche vehicle as early as 1911 when Edison tried to build one--much like Tesla.
If you're so sure of that, maybe you should put all your money in fuel cell technology.
I'll keep my money in EV technology. It's done pretty good so far. How much money do you have in fuel cell technology?
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
I don't do venture capital TYVM.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
Of course you don't. I guess you're not so confident in the fuel cell technology after all.
I still laugh at your prediction that fuel cell technology will overtake EVs. You've provided zero proof so it must be your opinion (and we all know how much your opinion is worth).
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
Of course you don't. I guess you're not so confident in the fuel cell technology after all.
I still laugh at your prediction that fuel cell technology will overtake EVs. You've provided zero proof so it must be your opinion (and we all know how much your opinion is worth).
I'm confident that most of the start up companies building them will fail miserably, like Rivan.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
What about the legacy car companies? They're cranking our the EVs like wildfire because of the demand. The wait for a new Tesla is typically 6 months to a year. You should buy one (if you can afford it).
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
They're only doing it because they are raking in tens, if not hundreds, of millions in tax incentives, subsidies, and other government handouts. If they weren't getting all that 'free' money, they wouldn't be building a battery car at all.
Tesla may have a wait for a vehicle, but they're hardly selling a large number compared to the market as a whole. EV's are still just a few percent of the market. You might also note that Tesla's are one of the short resale vehicles due to many buyers not being happy with the product. Tesla customer support is bad, the cars are some of the worst quality ones on the market, and you get all that shitty service and quality at a premium car cost. So, many buyers dump their Tesla never to return.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/25/cars/tesla-jdpower-rankings/index.html
https://www.slashgear.com/909209/the-truth-behind-the-terrible-resale-value-of-electric-cars/
https://www.hotcars.com/reasons-why-buying-a-tesla-is-a-bad-idea/
I can't speak for you, but I'm not buying a $70,000 Yugo that runs on D cells...
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
It must be nice to make shit up to appear like you know what you're talking about. Check out the EV sales trends:
EV Sales Hit New Record in Q2 2022
Wednesday July 13, 2022
New-vehicle sales in the second quarter struggled, up only modestly from the first quarter and down more than 20% from Q2 2021. The reasons are well documented – tight inventory, high prices, consumer sentiment dropping. There were a few positive notes in the Q2 sales numbers, and among them EV sales stood out the most. Sales of battery-powered electric vehicles – pure EVs – jumped to 196,788, a record high and a 13% increase from Q1.
The Kelley Blue Book team has finished their best estimates of electrified vehicle sales in Q2. The full Q2 report is posted below, with model- and brand-level details. Here are 10 quick takeaways.
Tesla remains the dominant player in the market. Not the EV market, but the luxury market in total. In Q2, Tesla was the top-selling luxury brand in the U.S., outpacing all the established names: Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Lexus, Mercedes-Benz, etc. As new EV models continue to enter the market, Tesla’s share of the EV segment is dropping. Last quarter, it fell to 66%, down 9% from Q1. Still, Tesla’s EV share is expected to shrink as the EV market expand. The bigger story is Tesla’s continued growth. Last quarter, the free-wheeling brand from Austin nearly outsold Subaru in the U.S.
Sales of electrified vehicles – combined EVs, hybrids, and fuel-cell-powered vehicles – jumped to 442,740 in Q2, an increase of 12.9% from year-ago levels. Electrified vehicles account for 12.6% of the U.S. market last quarter.
In Q2, EV sales accounted for 5.6% of the total market, an increase from 5.3% in Q1 and a record high. EV share in Q2 2021 was 2.7%.
With gas prices spending time above $5.00 in Q2, interest in hybrids and EVs surged. Interest, however, does not always translate into sales. Sales of hybrids and plug-in hybrids dropped 10.2% in Q2 year-over-year, as tight inventory held sales in check. Still, hybrid sales increased compared to Q1 to 245,204.
cancel2 2022
Canceled
Rivian is toast!
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
BFD. A 13% increase in nothing is nothing. Right now, the percentage of EV vehicles on the road in the US is about 1% of the total. That's nothing.
https://graphics.reuters.com/AUTOS-ELECTRIC/USA/mopanyqxwva/
https://usafacts.org/articles/how-many-electric-cars-in-united-states/
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
If you can't see the trend in EV technology, I can't help you. You've been blinded by the right.
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
Your problem is that you are wishing for an outcome without bothering to look at any data or reality. Without massive, and ongoing, government subsidy and support the EV industry would dry up and blow away. There wouldn't be one at all. EV is a matter of idiot politicians--particularly on the Left--wanting the same outcome you do and like you are willing to pay using OPM whatever it takes to get it.
Geeko Sportivo
Verified User
I am happy just to know that both Hydrogen and Electric vehicles are now available.
Technology is not a POLITICAL matter.
If you stand in the way of technology for political gain- YOU NEED TO HAVE YOUR HEAD EXAMINED!
I remember when Butane and Gasoline Forklifts were all that were available- However, warehouses had to keep all of their doors open and workers had to work in extreme cold and hot environments due to workers being overcome with Carbon Monoxide, PEOPLE DIED, then Battery Operated Forklifts and other equipment were created to resolve this issue.
Now many warehouses are Temperature controlled at 72 degrees! THANKS TECHNOLOGY!
Do you need any more example of how technology resolved major problems? Because I have 1,000's of other examples of how Technology improved our lives.
Technology is not a POLITICAL matter.
If you stand in the way of technology for political gain- YOU NEED TO HAVE YOUR HEAD EXAMINED!
I remember when Butane and Gasoline Forklifts were all that were available- However, warehouses had to keep all of their doors open and workers had to work in extreme cold and hot environments due to workers being overcome with Carbon Monoxide, PEOPLE DIED, then Battery Operated Forklifts and other equipment were created to resolve this issue.
Now many warehouses are Temperature controlled at 72 degrees! THANKS TECHNOLOGY!
Do you need any more example of how technology resolved major problems? Because I have 1,000's of other examples of how Technology improved our lives.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
You're doing exactly what you're accusing me of doing when you say:
"Without massive, and ongoing, government subsidy and support the EV industry would dry up and blow away".
You've produced zero evidence to support your lame theory above.
People were buying EVs BEFORE the Govt subsidies. Did Trump have EV subsidies between 2016-2020 during the EV explosion?
I think you know the answer.
Your surrender is accepted. Now, run along, boy.
The new Ford EV pickup was just tested with a 3500# trailer load and it made it 110 miles and when towing an 8500# camper it made it nearly 90 miles on a full charge.
Sounds like fun. The good news, given the government will give you a $7500 tax credit, Ford just raised the price by $8000. Gotta love alt-leftie tree huggers.
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
Here's a one example of many why I'm correct. If government didn't subsidize EV charging stations how many would there be?
https://electriccitycorp.com/federa...centage of the charger and installation costs.
Do you have $2,000 to $3,000 in spare cash lying around to install a charging station at your home? Most people don't. That's a big investment for them. If you live in an apartment, you are just fucked since you have no place to charge your car unless your landlord wants to fork over that money to put in charging stations--and few would. There's no incentive for a landlord to do it short of them charging a premium to make money off those stations and you in addition to your rent.
https://homeguide.com/costs/electric-car-charging-stations-cost
We know that EV cars cost more than ICE vehicles do. Installing a level 2 charging station in your home will run about $2,000 on top of that. If you are a consumer on a budget, do you spend thousands more for an EV in upfront costs to gain small savings in fuel costs over many years, or do you buy a much cheaper ICE vehicle that is far more affordable upfront?
The answer for most people is buy the ICE vehicle. The radical Leftists that want a world of EV's recognize that and slap big subsidies and other incentives to virtually force people into EV's because they know they won't buy them in a free and competitive market.
Here's what Norway had to do to get people to buy EV's and get a majority of them on the road there:
The Norwegian EV incentives:
No purchase/import tax on EVs (1990-)
Exemption from 25% VAT on purchase (2001-)
No annual road tax (1996-2021). Reduced tax from 2021. Full tax from 2022.
No charges on toll roads (1997- 2017).
No charges on ferries (2009- 2017).
Maximum 50% of the total amount on ferry fares for electric vehicles (201
Maximum 50% of the total amount on toll roads (201
Free municipal parking (1999- 2017)
Access to bus lanes (2005-). New rules allow local authorities to limit the access to only include EVs that carry one or more passengers (2016-)
50 % reduced company car tax (2000-2018). Company car tax reduction reduced to 40% (201and 20 percent from 2022.
Exemption from 25% VAT on leasing (2015-)
The Norwegian Parliament decided on a national goal that all new cars sold by 2025 should be zero-emission (electric or hydrogen) (2017).
Charging right for people living in apartment buildings was established (2017-)
Public procurement: From 2022 cars needs to be ZEV. From 2025 the same applies to city buses
https://elbil.no/english/norwegian-...municipal parking (1999- 2017) More items...
Short of such draconian and costly measures, EV's aren't going to ever be popular in an open and competitive marketplace.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
Your numbers are off. I had an electrician install my home charger for $1,400. But I had to wait two months because they were backlogged because of EV demand.
And Tesla was installing their own charging network before the Govt did. Between 2016-2020, Trump didn't do squat for EVs, yet they still broke sales records every year. If you really think the EV market won't survive, maybe you should short Tesla and make a bundle. <Haw, haw>
People love EVs because they drive better, they have no flammable gasoline, no coolant, no oil, no transmission. ICE cars have hundreds of moving parts. EVs have one. And because of their regenerative braking, you rarely have brake maintenance. And because the motor is so simple and requires less space, you have more cargo space.
There's a reason almost every car manufacturer has introduced at least one EV model in the last few years. And it isn't because of Govt subsidies.
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
Anecdote isn't evidence. During the Trump years, subsidies and other incentives already in place continued so that argument is moot. EV's breaking their own sales "records" is meaningless too. Only about 1% of US autos today are EV's. They simply are not that popular despite the propaganda the Left in the MSM puts out. Aside from that, not everyone--in fact the vast majority of people--can't afford to fork over even $1,400 to put in a charging station.
During the Obama administration, large subsidies for charging stations were handed out only to fail miserably. Things in that respect really haven't changed. The primary reason for EV buying seems to continue to be either virtue signaling or as a second car by the upper end of the middle class for commuting and other shortrange purposes.
Your incorrect opinion is meaningless too. EV's are flammable because of their massive battery pack. They have coolant too. It's necessary to maintain the battery pack at a constant temperature. They have hundreds of moving parts too. Regenerative braking is a sop to slightly increase efficiency, and can be matched at least in manual transmission vehicles with engine braking--another thing you likely know nothing about.
Because the trajectory of government is forcing things towards EV's regardless of their unpopularity in the marketplace. That's what happens when you let retards on the radical Left run your government. They run it straight into the ground and fuck everybody over.
Joe Capitalist
Racism is a disease
Therein lies the tragic flaw in your argument. EVs are wildly popular in the marketplace, regardless of what you believe from reading your far right media sources.
Like I said, if you're really confident that the EV industry will fall, them go ahead and short Tesla. Easy money, right?
I can't wait to hear how that turns out for you. Or you could just send more money to Trump. You lose either way.
And your attempt to make this a left wing conspiracy fails miserably.
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
No, they're not "wildly popular." If they were they'd be more than the pitiful 1% of the market they currently are.
As for Tesla, who'd want a POS quality, overpriced vehicle, that gives the supposed owner no right to repair? Who the fuck would want a vehicle that the manufacturer can monitor continuously and if they are so inclined, just shut it off and leave you ass fucked wherever you are whenever they want? Tesla could do that if they are so inclined. If government tomorrow totally withdrew their massive monetary and legislative support from the EV market, it would collapse overnight.
The Left are the ones pushing EV's, that's a fact. You don't find many Republicans voting for billions in EV subsidies and passing Greentard legislation.