Archaeology of the New Testament

[Into the Night]

My use of deep is because you play dumb, generally more than on e per post.

Your use of "Derp" is because you have lost context again.

 

[Into the Night]

I play a rational person with the ability to observe and form opinions based on easily identifiable details.

You consider your preaching a 'play' now?

 

[Into the Night]

Reality is something you'll never get!

Inversion fallacy. You can't blame your problem on me or anybody else.

 

[Into the Night]

You are just angry at something you heard 40 years ago in Sunday school.

None of that disproves the concept that a rational, lawful universe is caused by a rational agency.

Irrational statement.
There is no 'law of the Universe'.
The Universe is unorganized.
How does any event create a thing the event itself must exist in?

And none of it proves that atheism is the truth.

He is not an atheist. He is a fundamentalist.

And it absolutely has nothing to do with cosmological fine tuning; the convergence of the universal physical constants and net cosmic energy balance on values that appear balanced on the edge of a razor blade to allow matter and the universe to exist.

There is no such thing as 'universal physical constants'.
There is no such thing as 'net cosmic energy'.
Cliche fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

The universe would not be lawful, comprehensible, predictable if it were actually true that it is random and unorganized.

Irrational statement.
There is no 'law of the Universe'.
The Universe is unorganized.

 

[Into the Night]

Never said a,single word about proof.

Lie. Denial.

"Basic" is not a word that I would use. It's statistically improbable all these universal constants would all converge on the exact values to support atomic matter and a stable space time. Fine tuning is a legitimate scientific and philosophical question.

Math error. Failure to declare boundary. Failure to declare variance. Failure to declare data source. Failure to select by randN. Failure to normalize by paired randR. Failure to calculate margin of error. Failure to calculate average. Denial of statistical mathematics.
Failure to declare randX. Failure to declare boundary. Denial of probability mathematics.

Statistical math is not probability math.
There is no such thing as a 'universal constant'. Buzzword fallacy.
The Universe is not an atom.
The Universe is not 'stable space time'.
There is no 'fine tuning'.
The Universe is not science.
The Universe is not philosophy.
The Universe is not a question.

The question isn't about proof.
It's about what seems to be a better explanation:

Attempted proof by math error.

That the rational, lawful, and material was caused by the irrational, inanimate, and immaterial?

Irrational statement.

Or that the rational and lawful was caused by the rational and purposeful.

Irrational statement.

The Universe is unorganized.

 

[Cypress]

The Universe is unorganized!!!

 

[Melchizedek=Tecumseh]

Inversion fallacy. You can't blame your problem on me or anybody else.

I have no problems, nice try dickhead

 

[ZenMode]

Your use of "Derp" is because you have lost context again.

Nope. It's because you insist on playing dumb.

 

[ZenMode]

You consider your preaching a 'play' now?

I consider stating the obvious to be what I am doing. I do that while you and @Cypress exist in a world of denial.

You can't acknowledge obvious flaws and cypress just wants to throw around straw men and focus on the part that is convenient for his argument.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

Never said a,single word about proof.

"Basic" is not a word that I would use. It's statistically improbable all these universal constants would all converge on the exact values to support atomic matter and a stable space time. Fine tuning is a legitimate scientific and philosophical question.

The question isn't about proof.
It's about what seems to be a better explanation:

That the rational, lawful, and material was caused by the irrational, inanimate, and immaterial?

Or that the rational and lawful was caused by the rational and purposeful.

all your ideas and the words you used to desribe them are wrong.

you're a fucking imbecile.

 

[Cypress]

So, again, you believe that your God "rationally" designed and created the universe, at a molecular level, but just half-assed it on the designed of the one mammal he created that he wanted to have a relationship with and the one planet he created to put the mammal on?

The fact that I could get sunburned, get skin cancer, or die in a flood tells me absolutely nothing about the purpose and value of a human life nor the origin of the cosmos.

You are obviously jaded and cynical about life and the universe, and see flaw, imperfection, and mistake wherever you look.

I marvel at the improbability of both the existence and design of the universe - and I believe the ordinary fact of human existence is a miracle that the cynical and jaded just take for granted. Being alive is the most extraordinary, improbable, and miraculous twist of chance any of us experience. Our experience of sentient consciousness, love, and freedom is undoubtedly so precious and rare in the cosmos it seems to be objectively meaningful.

The question that all but the most jaded will inevitably ask is how am I supposed to understand and interpret the extremely improbable fact of my existence.

 

[Cypress]

You can't acknowledge obvious flaws and cypress just wants to throw around straw men and focus on the part that is convenient for his argument.

I read and considered your comments, but I concluded that the fact that I could get sunburned, get skin cancer, or die in a flood tells me absolutely nothing about the purpose and value of a human life, nor about the origin of the cosmos.

You are obviously jaded and cynical about life and the universe, and see flaw, imperfection, and mistake wherever you look.

I marvel at the improbability of both the existence and design of the universe - and I believe the ordinary fact of human existence is a miracle that the cynical and jaded just take for granted.
Being alive is the most extraordinary, improbable, and miraculous twist of chance any of us could experience. Our experience of sentient consciousness, love, and freedom is undoubtedly so precious and rare in the cosmos it seems to be objectively meaningful.

The question that all but the most jaded will inevitably ask is: how am I supposed to understand and interpret the extremely improbable fact of my existence.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

The fact that I could get sunburned, get skin cancer, or die in a flood tells me absolutely nothing about the purpose and value of a human life nor the origin of the cosmos.

see.

this is the psychotic belief of a criminal.

You are obviously jaded and cynical about life and the universe, and see flaw, imperfection, and mistake wherever you look.

I marvel at the improbability of both the existence and design of the universe - and I believe the ordinary fact of human existence is a miracle that the cynical and jaded just take for granted. Being alive is the most extraordinary, improbable, and miraculous twist of chance any of us experience. Our experience of sentient consciousness, love, and freedom is undoubtedly so precious and rare in the cosmos it seems to be objectively meaningful.

The question that all but the most jaded will inevitably ask is how am I supposed to understand and interpret the extremely improbable fact of my existence.

you are a nazi who devalues human life.

 

[ZenMode]

The fact that I could get sunburned, get skin cancer, or die in a flood tells me absolutely nothing about the purpose and value of a human life nor the origin of the cosmos.

Right. You aren't reasoning objectively. You're reasoning religiously which is how you are able to explain away the many design flaws.

You are obviously jaded and cynical about life and the universe,

Not at all. I don't know why anything exists, including the universe and life. I just see it for what it is - a mystery.

and see flaw, imperfection, and mistake wherever you look.

"Mistake" implies intent. Something or something tried to do X but didn't do it correctly. The way the design of humans came about, evolution, was an imperfect process. The evolutionary process did a pretty damn good job, but imperfect in the ways I've mentioned many times.

I refer to mistakes because you are talking about an all-knowing designer creator who should NOT have made those mistakes.

The question that all but the most jaded will inevitably ask is how am I supposed to understand and interpret the extremely improbable fact of my existence.

How are you supposed to understand it? I don't think there is a "supposed to".

How do YOU, and billions of others, explain/understand it? In the same way ancient man explained things he didn't understand- you fill in the gaps in knowledge and understanding with a deity.

God of the Gaps.

 

[Cypress]

There is no such thing as a 'universal constant'!
Buzzword fallacy!

ftfy
'Universal constants in physics are foundational, empirically measured values that govern the fundamental laws of nature across space and time. The following key constants, maintained by the NIST Reference on Constants, Units, and Uncertainty, are central to our current understanding of the universe.'

Introduction to the Fundamental Physical Constants

 

[Cypress]

Right. You aren't reasoning objectively. You're reasoning religiously which is how you are able to explain away the many design flaws.

Not at all. I don't know why anything exists, including the universe and life. I just see it for what it is - a mystery.

You make decisions and choices all day long, every day in the face of incomplete information.

There is sufficient information to make a provisional choice about whether to believe a rational and lawful universe was caused by the irrational and inanimate, or whether it was caused by some kind of rational agency.

I refer to mistakes because you are talking about an all-knowing designer creator who should NOT have made those mistakes.

You are not making an atheist argument.
You are making the argument of someone who is just angry at Christianity.

You got this idea of a perfect god who makes everything perfect and flawless from somebody in your Sunday school.

None of my arguments have been based on the God of Abraham, and I have never suggested that any higher rational agency underlying the universe is supposed to make everything for the convenience, comfort, and safety of Homo Sapiens exclusively.

How are you supposed to understand it? I don't think there is a "supposed to".

You're free to wander through life never believing, or even wondering if their is any ultimate meaning or purpose. I choose to not live with that worldview.

How do YOU, and billions of others, explain/understand it? In the same way ancient man explained things he didn't understand- you fill in the gaps in knowledge and understanding with a deity.

Based on all the physics and abstractive logic I've mentioned in this thread, I am provisionally convinced that there is more to reality and to human life than just inanimate matter and energy.
In this universe, the improbable existence of sentient consciousness, love, justice, free will and freedom are such seemingly unique and precious features of the cosmos that I am convinced they have objective meaning beyond electrons, quarks, and bosons.

 

[ZenMode]

You make decisions and choices all day long, every day in the face of incomplete information.

Correct but, if I find my front door standing open, when I get home from work, I'm not going to explain it by saying a leprechaun broke into my house, stole my Lucky Charms and left the door open on his way out.

There is sufficient information to make a provisional choice about whether to believe a rational and lawful universe was caused by the irrational and inanimate, or whether it was caused by some kind of rational agency.

In your religion-oriented mind, yes. Again, it is infinitely more honest to just say "We don't know "

You are not making an atheist argument.
You are making the argument of someone who is just angry at Christianity.

I care nothing about Christianity and have no bad feelings toward it.

You got this idea of a perfect god who makes everything perfect and flawless from somebody in your Sunday school.

Well, yes, that's part of it. God is described as perfect and all-knowing, among other things, in the Bible. This specific discussion is more about YOUR claim that the god-creator was so detail oriented that he arranged the universe, at a molecular level, just so that among other things, all elements can fit neatly into an organized table....but the same god-creator overlooked design flaws in the ONE creature he created EVERYTHING for.

Just doesn't make sense if you look at it objectively, not religiously.

None of my arguments have been based on the God of Abraham, and I have never suggested that any higher rational agency underlying the universe is supposed to make everything for the convenience, comfort, and safety of Homo Sapiens exclusively.

Of course not. You literally can't make that claim because even you can see it's not true. You just don't see how little sense it makes to create ALL of this for one species of animal and then design that creature, and the planet he lives on, so poorly.

You're free to wander through life never believing, or even wondering if their is any ultimate meaning or purpose. I choose to not live with that worldview.

God of the Gaps.

Based on all the physics and abstractive logic I've mentioned in this thread, I am provisionally convinced that there is more to reality and to human life than just inanimate matter and energy.
In this universe, the improbable existence of sentient consciousness, love, justice, free will and freedom are such seemingly unique and precious features of the cosmos that I am convinced they have objective meaning beyond electrons, quarks, and bosons.

God of the Gaps.

 

[Melchizedek=Tecumseh]

I read and considered your comments, but I concluded that the fact that I could get sunburned, get skin cancer, or die in a flood tells me absolutely nothing about the purpose and value of a human life, nor about the origin of the cosmos.

You are obviously jaded and cynical about life and the universe, and see flaw, imperfection, and mistake wherever you look.

I marvel at the improbability of both the existence and design of the universe - and I believe the ordinary fact of human existence is a miracle that the cynical and jaded just take for granted.
Being alive is the most extraordinary, improbable, and miraculous twist of chance any of us could experience. Our experience of sentient consciousness, love, and freedom is undoubtedly so precious and rare in the cosmos it seems to be objectively meaningful.

The question that all but the most jaded will inevitably ask is: how am I supposed to understand and interpret the extremely improbable fact of my existence.

And you only see one side of the equation of life,step into the cornfield of Field of Dreams! I'll ask if you can get a one time pass,You can come back! Are you up for that?

 

[Cypress]

Correct but, if I find my front door standing open, when I get home from work, I'm not going to explain it by saying a leprechaun broke into my house, stole my Lucky Charms and left the door open on his way out.

In your religion-oriented mind, yes. Again, it is infinitely more honest to just say "We don't know "

I care nothing about Christianity and have no bad feelings toward it.

Well, yes, that's part of it. God is described as perfect and all-knowing, among other things, in the Bible. This specific discussion is more about YOUR claim that the god-creator was so detail oriented that he arranged the universe, at a molecular level, just so that among other things, all elements can fit neatly into an organized table....but the same god-creator overlooked design flaws in the ONE creature he created EVERYTHING for.

Just doesn't make sense if you look at it objectively, not religiously.

Of course not. You literally can't make that claim because even you can see it's not true. You just don't see how little sense it makes to create ALL of this for one species of animal and then design that creature, and the planet he lives on, so poorly.

God of the Gaps.

God of the Gaps.

You claim we don't know, but the fact is you have already made a choice in spite of incomplete information. Which is fine. Humans make choices based on incomplete information every day of the week.

You believe inanimate matter and energy is all that exists, and that a rational, lawful universe was caused by the irrational, immaterial, and inanimate.

If you deny that is your belief system, then you are telegraphing that you believe there is something higher up and further in beyond inanimate/irrational matter and energy.


One would have to be an extremely jaded person to never have marveled and wondered at the sheer improbability of this universe, and the implausible nature of the perfect storm that caused sentient consciousness, love, morality, free will and freedom to briefly exist in a tiny little corner of the cosmos.