Is Ken Paxton a Democratic Socialist?
- Thread starter QP!
- Start date
QP!
Verified User
Fine.
Now speak to the principle of what i said.
If this was James Tallarico or any 'lefty Populist Politician', using the tax code in this way to cherry pick a laundry list of their Products, and Programs to use the tax code to offset cost for do you think the right would be defending him and saying that is not socialist as it is a deduction and not direct cash?
Did they do that when Biden was trying to incentivize high efficiency appliances?
Matt Dillon
Retardium User
Oh! That was such bullshit, you fuckin' commie! That was attached to E.O. 13990, don't think I don't fuckin' know:
"
(iii) Job-Creating Appliance- and Building-Efficiency Standards: ‘‘Energy
Conservation Program for Appliance Standards: Procedures for Use in
New or Revised Energy Conservation Standards and Test Procedures for
Consumer Products and Commercial/Industrial Equipment,’’ 85 FR 8626
(February 14, 2020), with major revisions proposed by March 2021 and
any remaining revisions proposed by June 2021; ‘‘Energy Conservation
Program for Appliance Standards: Procedures for Evaluating Statutory Fac-
tors for Use in New or Revised Energy Conservation Standards,’’ 85 FR
50937 (August 19, 2020), with major revisions proposed by March 2021
and any remaining revisions proposed by June 2021; ‘‘Final Determination
Regarding Energy Efficiency Improvements in the 2018 International Energy
Conservation Code (IECC),’’ 84 FR 67435 (December 10, 2019), by May
2021; ‘‘Final Determination Regarding Energy Efficiency Improvements
in ANSI/ASHRAE/IES Standard 90.1–2016: Energy Standard for Buildings,
Except Low-Rise Residential Buildings,’’ 83 FR 8463 (February 27, 2018),
by May 2021"
Probably Obama wrote that E.O., no way Potato Biden did.
QP!
Verified User
this is a good thread to show how much bullshit the partisan right forces themselves to accept showing their brain simply cannot work in any form of unbiased analysis.
Biden incentivizing high efficiency appliance purchases via tax code = SOCIALISM.... Gov't trying to pick winners and losers.
Paxton incentivising GLP's 1's, Yoga, meditation, anything he wants via tax code = not socialism because he is on the right.
Get that bullshit out of here.
Matt Dillon
Retardium User
I see you're doing Alinsky rule #4.
"
4. "Make the enemy live up to their own book of rules. You can kill them with this. They
can no more obey their own rules than the Christian church can live up to
Christianity.“
QP!
Verified User
The point is not whether you agree with choice of Biden or Paxton but is on how gov't chooses to INCENTIVIZE and pay for these things.
The above is EXACTLY what zymurgy argues is OK for Paxton to do and NOT SOCIALISM while they also argued what Biden was doing there was WRONG, SOCIALISM and PICKING WINNERS AND LOSERS, and something gov't needed to stay out of.,
zymurgy's brain is now so broken that he fully accepts Paxton creating an entire list of HEALTHY LIFESTYLE CHOICES to fund via this method of gov't tax support.
But you can bet if a leftist Populist puts together their list the exact same complaints leveled against Biden would come back
I never said his programs were ok. I said they were not socialism
I notice you are running from your ignorance on tax policy and how claiming an expense equates to something becoming free
showing this level of child like ignorance - how the fuck do you expect anyone to take you seriously here?
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
Yes, Biden's subsidizing energy efficient appliances is the same stupidity as Paxton's subsidizing certain "healthy (?) lifestyles. If you needed a new appliance, or were already doing that healthy (?) lifestyle choice, you get it subsidized. If you weren't, there's little incentive to go out and start doing it just because you get a few bucks more back on your tax return.
QP!
Verified User
Right but why you are you AVOIDING responding to your core claim about me prior and my addressing of that while instead focusing on this which is not core.
Do you agree that NO ONE is working from a proper definition of socialism in these partisan debates, as i have said. Do you agree as utilized by the right the term socialism, whether it be Biden High efficiency appliances program or other is basically defined by this definition i created capturing all of the rights criticisms about such gov't interventions...
'You, the left are abandoning traditional free-market conservate type consideration — which leaves those choices to the market—in favor of state-guided economic engineering, That equals SOCIALISM!'
And if you agree, then explain how Ken Paxtons platform escapes the label?
QP!
Verified User
And AGAIN 99% of the Populist left stuff you guys label socialism IS NOT SOCIALISM if we retreat to the exacting definition.
What BOTH ARE, ARE EQUIVALENT by the same OPERATIVE definitions you smear the left Populist programs and choices while trying to excuse and defend the right populist programs and choices.
this that you would lob at the left applies equally to Paxton...
"...You, the left are abandoning traditional free-market conservate type consideration — which leaves those choices to the market—in favor of state-guided economic engineering, That equals SOCIALISM!'..."
QP!
Verified User
zymurgy says that is bullshit and would call you a shitstain. He believes is a good thing to get tax payers back some tax dollars via these cherry picked programs or lifestyle choices a politician would make.
he is arguing what Paxton is doing and what those on the right screamed socialism at Biden are not the same.
Of course he would reverse in an instant if this was Tallarico's programs and not Paxtons. We know that.
Matt Dillon
Retardium User
There is no such thing as Democracy in Socialism, bro.
It's party rule or fuck you, seriously.
T. A. Gardner
Serial Thread Killer
There is no one, "exacting definition" of Socialism. There is a general definition, but no one precise one. The general definition is that government does for society things that society could do for themselves. For example, government providing a military and justice system are not socialism as society as a whole cannot effectively do those things.
Matt Dillon
Retardium User
QP!
Verified User
On that we agree.
I have argued the term 'socialist' and 'democratic socialist' and 'Progressive' have no real meaning, especially as used by the right. they use it is a catch all smear for the left while allowing Trump and Paxton to advocate versions of the same Populist programs while looking for any excuse, of definitional triviality to say '...but when the right does it, it is not socialism'.
My argument is that if we craft the RIGHTS USE OF SOCIALISM as applied to the left as our operative definition such that we can all, at least be using one definition then this definition i created captures everything the right pushes into the SOCIALIST basket when accusing the left of it...
It there is a better OPERATIVE DEFINITION of how the right labels everything from Biden tax rebates for high efficiency appliances to Mamdani's grocery stores while excluding Ken Paxton's use of the tax rebates to incentivize GLP 1's and Yoga and meditation, etc... then please tell me?
Tell me how Paxton's gov't incentivized choices via the tax code do not fit.
If we had President AOC and she said 'I am going to use the Ken Paxton method and look at all my life choices and preferences and use the tax code to help you all to adopt them', is there anyone here on the right, who is not the worst type of partisan hack who would not agree the screams of socialism (operative definition) would not be endless?
QP!
Verified User
My argument is not that there is one definition. My argument is simply 'whatever definition you use for leftist Populism to call it socialism, then lets use that same one to assess right leaning Populism. Be CONSISTENT'.
If you take zymurgy stance you can have the most lefty Populist granola munching POTUS who comes to power and says 'my life choices and my lifestyle is the perfect one for everyone and the gov't needs to use the tax code and deductions to incentive you all to make all the same choices i do and as such here is now a giant list of tax offsets for the things i do that you can now take advantage of'.
As those on the right would scream SOCIALISM, zymurgy would defend against that and say it is not.
and again FINE, if we want to all retreat to TRUE definitions for socialism but then it must be applied EQUALLY to the leftist Populism of which almost none would conform with a strict socialist definition. They only fit under the expansive definition which then traps Paxton too.