racism is so gotdamn expensive.

[cawacko]

China can turn it around rather fast as it is a command economy

My question would be, why does being a command economy mean it can turn things around fast?

China has had amazing growth over the past several decades no doubt. But now they are facing the consequences of those actions, excessive debt, overbuilding etc.

China isn't going away, but their growth trajectory has changed and while not perfectly apples to apples there's a reason comparisons to Japan come up.

 

[Matt Dillon]

I live in a city that is 70% Latino


They have always been the nicest neighbors I’ve ever had


I have lived in mixed neighborhoods many a time

It was my experience that the DICK in the neighborhood was some white asshole who self appointed themselves the neighborhood king

As if everyone had to follow his rules

You can guess what those assholes got in return from me

Stop being a fucking racist

Somebody spit on some things.

 

[Nordberg]

Kinda like she handled the border, right?

She was not in chaarge of the wall. She was in negotiations with the countries they came from to try and cut down immigration. Biden deported huge numbers.

 

[cawacko]

Lifting 800 Million People Out of Poverty – New Report Looks at Lessons from China’s Experience​

BEIJING, April 1, 2022— Over the past 40 years, the number of people in China with incomes below $1.90 per day – the International Poverty Line as defined by the World Bank to track global extreme poverty– has fallen by close to 800 million. With this, China has contributed close to three-quarters of the global reduction in the number of people living in extreme poverty. At China’s current national poverty line, the number of poor fell by 770 million over the same period.

To take stock of this achievement, a joint study – “Four Decades of Poverty Reduction in China: Drivers, Insights for the World, and the Way Ahead” – was undertaken by China’s Ministry of Finance, the Development Research Center (DRC) of the State Council, and the World Bank, with the China Center for International Knowledge on Development (CIKD) acting as the implementing agency.

Lifting 800 Million People Out of Poverty – New Report Looks at Lessons from China’s Experience

Over the past 40 years, China has lifted nearly 800 million people out of poverty, accounting for more than 75 percent of global poverty reduction in the same period, according to a new report released on Thursday.

www.worldbank.org

China has been an amazing success story in this regard. It started after they moved away from Mao's centrally planned economy and started opening up their markets.

We can go back the late '90's and early 00's and there was the push to let China into the WTO etc. Now there's been some regret to that but that's a separate story.

But China's ascent really does speak to the power of markets in getting people out of poverty.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

China produces one-third of the world's manufactured goods. It can make almost everything. Why do you think a country that can make everything would go bankrupt because of debt? Who does it owe money to? Do you think some people inside the country owe money to others, and then the whole country collapses? Don't you think that kind of collapse is a bit unrealistic?

Way to change the subject!

 

[QP!]

My question would be, why does being a command economy mean it can turn things around fast?

In China the main reason is that one person particularly and his Politburo can make all decisions without any system of checks and balances.

Whether that ends up being good or bad, can be debated but it leads to much greater speed.

top decision-making body is the Politburo Standing Committee (a 7-member inner circle led by Xi Jinping), and the broader elite ruling group is the Politburo (25 members). [1, 2, 3]

China has had amazing growth over the past several decades no doubt. But now they are facing the consequences of those actions, excessive debt, overbuilding etc.

China isn't going away, but their growth trajectory has changed and while not perfectly apples to apples there's a reason comparisons to Japan come up.

China has tried to directly mirror a lot of took America from an emerging but small power prior to WW2, into the worlds strongest Super Power and what they saw was the mass uplift of people from the working poor, isolated farm type jobs, into interconnected cities and jobs that would create a burgeoning middle class that would create a cycle of increased GDP and wealth for the entire country including the elites.

And yes no country experiencing and managing such explosive growth should not experience serious challenges and consequences due to it. It happened in the US and CHina will have its struggles too.

 

[QP!]

China is extraordinarily lucky they got a ruler like Xi and not Putin or Trump.

Xi has always been OBSESSED with seeing China as the #1 nation in the world and realizes building the strongest middle class is how they get there.

What that means is Xi has given up the Putin or Trump path of focusing mostly on their personal riches FIRST while harming the golden goose and nation that produces it, long term. Xi realized he can still get fabulously rich and maybe even more so, over the long term, if he first builds the Countries sustainability.

It is also the biggest risk to CHina because if whoever takes over from Xi next in China is closer to Putin or Trump, they will gut the country wealth and destroy what is built faster than Putin or Trump has.

 

[cawacko]

In China the main reason is that one person particularly and his Politburo can make all decisions without any system of checks and balances.

Whether that ends up being good or bad, can be debated but it leads to much greater speed.





China has tried to directly mirror a lot of took America from an emerging but small power prior to WW2, into the worlds strongest Super Power and what they saw was the mass uplift of people from the working poor, isolated farm type jobs, into interconnected cities and jobs that would create a burgeoning middle class that would create a cycle of increased GDP and wealth for the entire country including the elites.

And yes no country experiencing and managing such explosive growth should not experience serious challenges and consequences due to it. It happened in the US and CHina will have its struggles too.

I don't fancy myself a China expert but my understanding is they've have massive debt issues, a property bust and pretty weak domestic consumption. And Xi's focus is on basically technological and industrial dominance rather than trying to grow the consumer spending side.

That doesn't mean China is no longer going to be a dominant player but their model has reached a point where change is necessary.

 

[cawacko]

You have never been to China have you?

The PRC isn't the Kuomintang of the 40's

I travel to the PRC many times on business from the 1990's up until 2021 when I did a 6 month contract at Boeing at the Zhoushan plant. Amazing growth and infrastructure

I've been to China once, in 2012, right before Xi took over. I went to Hangzhou and Shanghi. It was just a mass of humanity. Shanghi made NYC seem like a small suburb.

I also see why they've had the property bust they've had. The amount of construction was crazy and there weren't market fundamentals behind it.

 

[QP!]

I don't fancy myself a China expert but my understanding is they've have massive debt issues, a property bust and pretty weak domestic consumption. And Xi's focus is on basically technological and industrial dominance rather than trying to grow the consumer spending side.

That doesn't mean China is no longer going to be a dominant player but their model has reached a point where change is necessary.

Sure and America had all of these post ww2 ...

and yet despite these 'disasters' that hit the American economy and had to be managed during and after the fact and adjusted for, the US has still built more wealth in that time frame then at any time prior and then any other country.

I say that to say this... that when trying to PUSH a society from almost universal poverty to one of middle class affluence and in a relatively short time, you should EXPECT numerous really challenging periods, hurdles and even corrections and crashes..

China does not seem to be doing too badly.

The main issues i see for China is the aging population issues and that their artificial boom, due to such mass spending is now hitting somewhat of a wall.

I do not think the debt and related property bust and spending issues are that big. Maybe they trigger a recession period like the US has gone thru many times before the next uptick.

The next boom cycle should reboot all that, after a period of slow down (maybe recession) allowing things to catch up.

 

[cawacko]

Sure and America had all of these post ww2 ...

and yet despite these 'disasters' that hit the American economy and had to be managed during and after the fact and adjusted for, the US has still built more wealth in that time frame then at any time prior and then any other country.

I say that to say this... that when trying to PUSH a society from almost universal poverty to one of middle class affluence and in a relatively short time, you should EXPECT numerous really challenging periods, hurdles and even corrections and crashes..

China does not seem to be doing too badly.

The main issues i see for China is the aging population issues and that their artificial boom, due to such mass spending is now hitting somewhat of a wall.

I do not think the debt and related property bust and spending issues are that big. Maybe they trigger a recession period like the US has gone thru many times before the next uptick.

The next boom cycle should reboot all that, after a period of slow down (maybe recession) allowing things to catch up.

It basically comes down to whether its cyclical or structural. Time will answer that for us.

 

[QP!]

It basically comes down to whether its cyclical or structural. Time will answer that for us.

my answer would be 'both'.

As was the case in what triggered all those US recessions and corrections.

In a bull market cycle, the structural issues often get buried and moved past but sit waiting for a slow down to then play their heavy hand.

so while gov't can do all sorts of things to up consumer spending, eventually that train WILL slow and people need time to catch up. That cycle then exposes the structural issues of houses being over valued and over built, too much debt, etc.,

 

[Into the Night]

View: https://youtu.be/bPtisseFomw


Racism is so gotdamn expensive. Had the racist Hispanics and other immigrants not voted Trump back into the white house..., ther'd be no tariff wars, which means prices would be stable, No Iranian war, gas prices wouldn't be stable also.. No ICE agents hunting immigrants like fuckin animals, seniors, the poor wouldn't be the targets of massive cuts to satisfy the massive deficit and the uber riches tax breaks. Our allies would be still be our friends, Measles would still be a thing of the past, the Canadians would still be our number one trading partner, the white house, the reflecting pool, the rose garden, the Kennedy center, ALL WOULD BE IN TACK AND EVERY CRISES WOULD BE HANDLED BY PRESIDENT HARRIS EFFECTIVELY AND WITH SOME FUCKIN COMMON SENSE.

You can't blame your racism on anybody else, Red. Inversion fallacy. TDS.

 

[Into the Night]

China produces one-third of the world's manufactured goods. It can make almost everything. Why do you think a country that can make everything would go bankrupt because of debt? Who does it owe money to?

The government is in heavy debt, not the manufacturers.
The debt is owed to the ICBC, The China Construction Bank, the Agricultural Bank of China, and the Bank of China.

Do you think some people inside the country owe money to others, and then the whole country collapses? Don't you think that kind of collapse is a bit unrealistic?

It's already happening.

 

[Into the Night]

China has empty skyscraper neighborhoods.

Quite right. Whole cities with no one to live in them.
The Chinese government is trying to build it's way out of it's financial problems. It won't work.

Buildings don't have plumbing n stuff, so that's a problem.

Also quite right. They don't have the same building codes that you see in the United States.

 

[Into the Night]

I live in a city that is 70% Latino


They have always been the nicest neighbors I’ve ever had


I have lived in mixed neighborhoods many a time

It was my experience that the DICK in the neighborhood was some white asshole who self appointed themselves the neighborhood king

As if everyone had to follow his rules

You can guess what those assholes got in return from me

Stop being a fucking racist

Inversion fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

It basically comes down to whether its cyclical or structural. Time will answer that for us.

It already has.

 

[Into the Night]

She was not in chaarge of the wall. She was in negotiations with the countries they came from to try and cut down immigration. Biden imported huge numbers.

FTFY

 

[evince]

Somebody spit on some things.

It was a great big white boy who was selling drugs

My neighbors of any color here don’t sell drugs

 

[evince]

China has been an amazing success story in this regard. It started after they moved away from Mao's centrally planned economy and started opening up their markets.

We can go back the late '90's and early 00's and there was the push to let China into the WTO etc. Now there's been some regret to that but that's a separate story.

But China's ascent really does speak to the power of markets in getting people out of poverty.

But their fast rise did involve stealing technology from the US and others