AI bubble burst

[Into the Night]

"Starknet is not a blockchain currency. It only uses blockchain for trading."

That is just wordplay.

Nope.It is exactly as I described.

STRK is Starknet’s native token.

Nope. Etherium is what Starknet is based upon. Etherium is a blockchain currency. Starknet is not.

It pays network transaction fees,

No. It CHARGES network transaction fees.

is used for staking and network security,

It is not used for either. It is a transaction overlayer in an attempt to scale Etherium. It won't work.

and participates in governance—not “only trading.” Starknet’s own documentation says so.

So? It is not a blockchain currency.

At this point, you are not defining “blockchain currency.”

I already have. Go back and read it. RQAA

You are simply excluding every example that makes your claim look foolish.

No, Zy. YOU are attempting to claim numerous currencies as 'blockchain' currencies when they aren't.

according to your retardism, dollars are not currency either.

Yes they are, Zy. ALL fiat currencies are currency.

They are just paper and database entries used for trading.

Still a currency.

 

[IBDaMann]

Blockchain based currency is not a fiat currency.

The problem is that you don't know what a fiat currency is.

Wrong. It's value cannot be set by any government action.

Congress could declare the value of one token to be the value of one banana. You don't seem to understand the power granted to Congress. They could tie the value to another currency if they wished.

They value is determined by the market.

That's how we want it to be; this does not take away from what Congress could do.

The only 'database' is the blockchain. The blockchain does not just disappear.

I'm sure you read where I wrote that the blockchain is not where you should be looking. The magician tells the audience to look at his left hand while he performs the trick with his right hand. The crypto managers tell you to fixate on the blockchain so you don't see the shenanigans going on all around the blockchain.

Fall for what? Their value is set by the market.

You bought into crypto, didn't you? You went the way of Xadoman and you can't break free. Good luck with that.

A blockchain is not 'onshore' or 'offshore'. It is simply a blockchain.

I see that you are still focusing on the blockchain even though I have only been discussing the exchange, which is where the fraud occurs. How much did you lose last year?

I don't invest in it myself,

I see you refer to crypto as an "investment." You definitely shouldn't be getting involved in crypto. Whoever is selling you on it is not your friend.

but I know how it works

I wouldn't go that far.

and why it is NOT a fiat currency.

You have a whole lot that you need to learn about it. You don't know anything about the exchanges that are out there, you don't know what power Congress has, and you don't even know what a fiat currency is.

There is no exchange.

How do people buy tokens?

There is no 'parlor'.

There most certainly is.

Nope. The Federal Reserve does,

Now you are conflating the Fed's oversight of banking with the government's control over fiscal policy.

Overtaxation causes a tax revolt and a tax crash.

Overtaxation is bad and yes, it causes revolt.

Borrowing too much causes a loss of confidence in the bonds and a debt crash.

Yep. Greece anyone?

Blockchain cannot be printed at will.

... and you just finished telling me that you understood how this works. You should have been paying attention to the Safe Moon conversations. The way a cryptocurrency prints "at will" is:
1) halts all activity on the cryptocurrency, effectively freezing it
2) creates a second one (at a starting price of the managers' choosing)
3) announces that all holders of the first cryptocurrency must "convert" to the second, at the price listed, incurring all the same transaction fees
4) ... and the coup de gras, the second cryptocurrency is opened to the public where they can sell as much as they want, i.e. print as much as they wish.

If you were focusing on the blockchain then you missed it, and you got fleeced.

There only a limited number of 'coins' in the blockchain.

... so they create a second cryptocurrency and voila! Problem solved.

After that, no more 'coins' can be created.

You don't know how this works. The contract determines how and when new coins shall be created.

There is faith in cryptocurrency,

... only by those duped by FOMO who rush to be fleeced.

How much faith is there in Safe Moon? ... in Bull Dog? ... in the 48,000 cryptocurrencies that were introduced over the last two years that are now defunct.

Answer: 0

This is because people were using Bitcoin as an investment, so it tended to shoot up and down as people cashed in and out of it for their local currency.

Nope, that's not why.

Gold and silver as currency has been used for thousands of years. You cannot undo that.

Gold and silver aren't used as national currencies anywhere; you can't undo that.

Fiat currencies are all that work, and thus fiat currencies are all that governments use; you can't undo that.

Nope. They have been used as currency for thousands of years.

The past is not the present going forward.

Blockchains do exist. They ARE the tokens.

You are drifting back into your accounting illiteracy. The blockchain holds the transactions and says who owns how many nonexistent tokens ... but there aren't any tokens anywhere.

The blockchain ARE the tokens.

You need to learn how all this works.

... since you don't understand how blockchain currency works and why it is not a fiat currency.

Cypress fallacy. I don't support your delusional narrative so I must not understand the subject matter.

Learn what a fiat currency is.

No word game going here...just a lack of understanding what blockchain currency really is.

You are the one calling it an investment.

Blockchain currency is NOT fiat currency.

It is. It cannot be anything else. You fell for the word "coin" and now you treat cryptocurrency as though it has tangible, intrinsic value ... but there is nothing there that even exists. You are in a world of hurt.

There is no management.

Who did your blindfolding?

It doesn't run 'out of' anywhere.

You've never heard of other countries?

IF the government were to create a blockchain algorithm, that algorithm exists, and the blockchain so created exists.

If you have a thought, that thought exists. You can even use it as a fiat currency if you can get others to go along with your game.

Now, the actual problems with blockchain currency: First and foremost, blockchain currencies require use of the internet to conduct a transaction.

You have already emphasized this as your main concern. Get stronger encryption.

Fiat paper or coin currency and gold and silver do not.

Fiat paper or coin currency and gold and silver cannot be "backed up" with several copies such that you're covered if the original is ever lost.

Blockchain currency requires technological knowledge to use that most people don't have

They can't use an app?

Blockchain currency requires a 'wallet' to store the tokens created by the blockchain that you control.

Wallets do not store tokens; they store keys.

Blockchain currency will not succeed as a generally accepted currency due to these limitations on it.

Scams generally don't succeed as a generally accepted currency.

The closest right now is BitCoin, which is accepted as a currency at a few businesses (particularly in Japan and various locations in the United States, such as Las Vegas).

Yep. Bitcoin is actually in it to win it. It can actually be used as a currency.

 

[Into the Night]

and....this was not merely pre-mining.

No such thing, Zy.

YFI launched with a supply of 30,000 tokens, then its holders voted to create 6,666 more.

YFI is yet another example of a overlayer transaction currency. It uses Etherium also. It does not have any tokens.

So yes, the supply could be increased after launch—through a democratic governance vote.

There are currently no democracies anywhere in the world.
YFI is not a blockchain currency.

 

[Into the Night]

The problem is that you don't know what a fiat currency is.

Lame attempt, IBD.
A fiat currency is one that established by fiat, namely a governing body of some sort, designating that currency as the 'only acceptable' currency.

Congress could declare the value of one token to be the value of one banana.

They could, but currently a banana is 0.20 US tokens.

You don't seem to understand the power granted to Congress. They could tie the value to another currency if they wished.

Congress has no such legal authority. Indeed, they never had any legal authority to establish the fiat dollar.

That's how we want it to be; this does not take away from what Congress could do.

Congress has no such legal authority. See Article I of the Constitution of the United States.

I'm sure you read where I wrote that the blockchain is not where you should be looking.

I don't, for the reasons I've already described. Pay attention.

The magician tells the audience to look at his left hand while he performs the trick with his right hand. The crypto managers tell you to fixate on the blockchain so you don't see the shenanigans going on all around the blockchain.

What 'shenanigans'? Blockchain currency IS the blockchain.

You bought into crypto, didn't you?

No, for the reasons I have already described. Pay attention.

You went the way of Xadoman and you can't break free. Good luck with that.

No. I have nothing to 'break free' from. Remind me again which currency Xadoman was going on about.

I see that you are still focusing on the blockchain even though I have only been discussing the exchange, which is where the fraud occurs. How much did you lose last year?

I don't invest in blockchain currencies, IBD, for the reasons I've just described. Pay attention.

I see you refer to crypto as an "investment."

I would say that most people look at it that way. Few treat it as a general currency.

You definitely shouldn't be getting involved in crypto. Whoever is selling you on it is not your friend.

I don't invest in blockchain currencies or any crypto currency (other than the USD). I have already described why. Pay attention.

I wouldn't go that far.


You have a whole lot that you need to learn about it. You don't know anything about the exchanges that are out there, you don't know what power Congress has, and you don't even know what a fiat currency is.

Repetition fallacy (chanting). Argument of the Stone fallacy.

How do people buy tokens?

They can sell something for BitCoin, they can use any number of reliable exchanges to convert a local currency to BitCoin and back again, they can mine for a BitCoin.

There most certainly is.
Now you are conflating the Fed's oversight of banking with the government's control over fiscal policy.

It is the same.

Overtaxation is bad and yes, it causes revolt.

At least you agree to this.

Yep. Greece anyone?

Not the problem with Greece. The problem with Greece is sheer laziness.

... and you just finished telling me that you understood how this works. You should have been paying attention to the Safe Moon conversations. The way a cryptocurrency prints "at will" is:

Ah yes...the Safe Moon shit that Xadoman was pushing.

It was a transactional blockchain only. No blockchain 'coin'. No hash algorithm defining a blockchain. It was all simply a scam, charging fees for every transaction, and was directly managed (skimmed) by Safe Moon, the management company.

1) halts all activity on the cryptocurrency, effectively freezing it

It's gone. Fraud can be a costly thing.

2) creates a second one (at a starting price of the managers' choosing)

Still fraud. It's gone too.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Nice quote of the 1st amendment. Do you have a purpose for posting it here?

3) announces that all holders of the first cryptocurrency must "convert" to the second, at the price listed, incurring all the same transaction fees
4) ... and the coup de gras, the second cryptocurrency is opened to the public where they can sell as much as they want, i.e. print as much as they wish.

Of course. Still fraud.

If you were focusing on the blockchain then you missed it, and you got fleeced.

Not a blockchain currency. A fraud masquerading as one.

.. so they create a second cryptocurrency and voila! Problem solved.

Heh. Didn't solve their problems, did it?

You don't know how this works. The contract determines how and when new coins shall be created.

Blockchain currency has no 'contract'. It is simply the hash algorithm of the core blockchain itself.
Safe Moon is not a blockchain currency. It only used blockchain to conduct transactions through Safe Moon central offices, which skimmed off the top for each transaction.

... only by those duped by FOMO who rush to be fleeced.

How much faith is there in Safe Moon? ... in Bull Dog? ... in the 48,000 cryptocurrencies that were introduced over the last two years that are now defunct.

Answer: 0

And this was my point. The general public (including you) does not know how a blockchain currency works, and can't tell the difference between a ponzi scheme like Safe Moon and a blockchain currency.

Nope, that's not why.

Gold and silver aren't used as national currencies anywhere; you can't undo that.

And this is the bubble. The world has never been here before.

Fiat currencies are all that work, and thus fiat currencies are all that governments use; you can't undo that.

Gold and silver has been used as currency (including national currency) from approximately 700BC to 1971, when the United States was the last nation to leave the gold standard.

The past is not the present going forward.

This sounds like the mindless Tesla argument.

You are drifting back into your accounting illiteracy.

ALL currencies are a unit of account, IBD.

The blockchain holds the transactions and says who owns how many nonexistent tokens ... but there aren't any tokens anywhere.

The blockchain IS the tokens, IBD.

You need to learn how all this works.

I do know how all this works, and why scams like Safe Moon were the scams they were.

Cypress fallacy. I don't support your delusional narrative so I must not understand the subject matter.

Denial of logic. Cypress is not a fallacy.
You are attempting to equivicate a blockchain transaction with a blockchain currency. They are NOT the same.

Learn what a fiat currency is.

I already know. A currency is a store of value and a unit of account. This is true for ANY currency, whether fiat or otherwise.

You are the one calling it an investment.

It is. You invest in US dollars. So do I. I also invest in gold and silver. I do not invest in blockchain currency or any of the Ponzi scams masquerating as a blockchain currency, such as Safe Moon,

It is. It cannot be anything else. You fell for the word "coin" and now you treat cryptocurrency as though it has tangible, intrinsic value ... but there is nothing there that even exists. You are in a world of hurt.

It is called BitCoin,IBD. You cannot change it's name. The solved puzzle is called a 'coin'.

Currency is not a value. It is a STORE of value and a unit of account.
In other words, it is nothing more than a medium of barter.

Who did your blindfolding?
You've never heard of other countries?
If you have a thought, that thought exists. You can even use it as a fiat currency if you can get others to go along with your game.

A blockchain currency is not a fiat currency.

You have already emphasized this as your main concern. Get stronger encryption.

You cannot change the blockchain algorithm. The currency is DEFINED by that algorithm. Changing the algorithm means it is a different currency.

Fiat paper or coin currency and gold and silver cannot be "backed up" with several copies such that you're covered if the original is ever lost.

Paper dollars are gathered by banks every day and sent to the Federal Reserve to be destroyed. They are literally worn out from being in so many pockets and wallets. New ones are issued in their place.

The same thing happens with coins, but more slowly, particularly now, since US coins are so worthless these days.

They can't use an app?
Wallets do not store tokens; they store keys.

Wrong. A BitCoin 'wallet' is just a file. You need a password to get into it. From there you can issue a transaction.

Scams generally don't succeed as a generally accepted currency.

BitCoin is not a scam. Safe Moon is. So is the fiat dollar, but Congress has yet to pay the full price for it's folly.

Yep. Bitcoin is actually in it to win it. It can actually be used as a currency.

Win what?

Yes, it can actually be used as a currency. You can buy and sell stuff with it.
You can do the same thing with Etherium, but there are not as many participants.

Neither will become a general currency, for the reasons I've already described.

 

[IBDaMann]

A fiat currency is one that established by fiat, namely a governing body of some sort

Nope. A fiat currency is one whose value is determined solely by the faith of the reciever in exchange for goods and services, i.e. value by fiat with no tangible, intrinsic value otherwsie associated with the currency.

If you and I and a group of friends decide to use GI Joe action figures as currency amongst ourselves, or MAD Magazines, we will have established a fiat currency. Similarly, if we decide to use invisible (nonexistent) "tokens" as currency amongst ourselves, and we keep tabs on who has how many and what transactions have occurred on a spreadsheet, we will have established a fiat currency. If me move our invisible token currency to a laptop and use cryptography to protect the ledger, we will have made our fiat currency a cryptocurrency.

The fact that there is a ledger that is protected by cryptography does not somehow change the underlying fiat currency.

, designating that currency as the 'only acceptable' currency.

I knew it. You were conflating "fiat currency" with "legal tender."

Congress has no such legal authority. Indeed, they never had any legal authority to establish the fiat dollar.

Congress absolutely has the legal authority to regulate the value of any currency it makes:

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

Congress has no such legal authority. See Article I of the Constitution of the United States.

Alright, let's look at Article I of the Constitution:

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

It doesn't seem to have changed.

I don't, for the reasons I've already described. Pay attention.

Let's just say that if you were secretly addicted to gambling with crypto and weren't admitting to it, I wouldn't be surprised. You are in Xadoman's camp over all the wrong things.

What 'shenanigans'? Blockchain currency IS the blockchain.

Your EVASION of the exchange is transparent.

Remind me again which currency Xadoman was going on about.

You are right to have lost track; it was a different 'hot' new crypto every couple of months. It started with Safe Moon, with his "What's everybody's 'made it' car?" thread. He was certain he was going to be making 50x-100x in relatively short order. When Safe Moon deflated he didn't miss a beat talking about how exciting Evergrow was looking, then Bull Dog, then others.

I don't invest in blockchain currencies, IBD, for the reasons I've just described.

I know you don't invest in them because you can't. I asked if you gamble with them in the hopes that this time it won't be a scam ... you know, like Charlie Brown getting up the motivation to kick the ball, that this time there won't be any ball/rug-pull. I'm just wondering.

You keep EVADING the topic of the exchanges.

I would say that most people look at it that way.

The world is full of stupid people.

Few treat it as a general currency.

... showing the general caliber of typical fly eager to enter the spider's parlor.

They can sell something for BitCoin, they can use any number of reliable exchanges to convert a local currency to BitCoin and back again, they can mine for a BitCoin.

... and only Bitcoin. You can't buy a Big Mac with Cardano [ August 2021: $2.85 | August 2026: $0.19 ]

Not the problem with Greece. The problem with Greece is sheer laziness.

The laziness is the root problem. The immediate problem is their extreme debt brought about by their decision to replace GDP with straight up borrowing.

Ah yes...the Safe Moon shit that Xadoman was pushing.

That would be it.

It was a transactional blockchain only.

Would you recognize a No True Scotsman fallacy if you were to see one?

It's gone. Fraud can be a costly thing.

Both Safemoon's now rest peacefully at just a tad over 1/10,000th of a cent, down from it's all-time high of just over 1/3rd of a cent.

Blockchain currency has no 'contract'. It is simply the hash algorithm of the core blockchain itself.

Homework for you: look up a few of the many cryptocurrencies and look at their contracts.

Safe Moon is not a blockchain currency.

It sure is. You are attempting to engage in a No True Scotsman fallacy. Safe Moon absolutely rode on a blockchain; you just don't want to acknowledge the shenanigans that occurred on the exchange.

It only used blockchain to conduct transactions through Safe Moon central offices, which skimmed off the top for each transaction.

I don't think anyone elected you to decide which uses were proper blockchain uses. Until you shift your focus to the ways blockchain can be abused on an exchange, regurgitating how great blockchain is doesn't cut it.

The general public (including you) does not know how a blockchain currency works, and can't tell the difference between a ponzi scheme like Safe Moon and a blockchain currency.

The general public (including you) does not know how an exchange works, or what a No True Scotsman fallacy is, and can't tell the difference between something with intrinsic value and something that doesn't even exist.

And this is the bubble. The world has never been here before.

Well, Zimbabwe has, and Venezuela, and some others. The point is that we don't want to be there. We know it's bad.

Gold and silver has been used as currency (including national currency) from approximately 700BC to 1971, when the United States was the last nation to leave the gold standard.

What is obvious is that you can't acknowledge the correct reason why the US left the gold standard.

The blockchain IS the tokens, IBD.

Delusion. There are no tokens. None exist. Each one is a fiction.

Cypress is not a fallacy.

Yes he is.

You are attempting to equivicate a blockchain transaction with a blockchain currency. They are NOT the same.

I am not equating the two. The currency is fictitious. The blockchain could be implemented as a ledger in a notebook.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

Nope. A fiat currency is one whose value is determined solely by the faith of the reciever in exchange for goods and services, i.e. value by fiat with no tangible, intrinsic value otherwsie associated with the currency.

If you and I and a group of friends decide to use GI Joe action figures as currency amongst ourselves, or MAD Magazines, we will have established a fiat currency. Similarly, if we decide to use invisible (nonexistent) "tokens" as currency amongst ourselves, and we keep tabs on who has how many and what transactions have occurred on a spreadsheet, we will have established a fiat currency. If me move our invisible token currency to a laptop and use cryptography to protect the ledger, we will have made our fiat currency a cryptocurrency.

The fact that there is a ledger that is protected by cryptography does not somehow change the underlying fiat currency.


I knew it. You were conflating "fiat currency" with "legal tender."


Congress absolutely has the legal authority to regulate the value of any currency it makes:

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;


Alright, let's look at Article I of the Constitution:

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

It doesn't seem to have changed.


Let's just say that if you were secretly addicted to gambling with crypto and weren't admitting to it, I wouldn't be surprised. You are in Xadoman's camp over all the wrong things.


Your EVASION of the exchange is transparent.


You are right to have lost track; it was a different 'hot' new crypto every couple of months. It started with Safe Moon, with his "What's everybody's 'made it' car?" thread. He was certain he was going to be making 50x-100x in relatively short order. When Safe Moon deflated he didn't miss a beat talking about how exciting Evergrow was looking, then Bull Dog, then others.


I know you don't invest in them because you can't. I asked if you gamble with them in the hopes that this time it won't be a scam ... you know, like Charlie Brown getting up the motivation to kick the ball, that this time there won't be any ball/rug-pull. I'm just wondering.

You keep EVADING the topic of the exchanges.


The world is full of stupid people.


... showing the general caliber of typical fly eager to enter the spider's parlor.


... and only Bitcoin. You can't buy a Big Mac with Cardano [ August 2021: $2.85 | August 2026: $0.19 ]



The laziness is the root problem. The immediate problem is their extreme debt brought about by their decision to replace GDP with straight up borrowing.


That would be it.


Would you recognize a No True Scotsman fallacy if you were to see one?


Both Safemoon's now rest peacefully at just a tad over 1/10,000th of a cent, down from it's all-time high of just over 1/3rd of a cent.


Homework for you: look up a few of the many cryptocurrencies and look at their contracts.


It sure is. You are attempting to engage in a No True Scotsman fallacy. Safe Moon absolutely rode on a blockchain; you just don't want to acknowledge the shenanigans that occurred on the exchange.


I don't think anyone elected you to decide which uses were proper blockchain uses. Until you shift your focus to the ways blockchain can be abused on an exchange, regurgitating how great blockchain is doesn't cut it.


The general public (including you) does not know how an exchange works, or what a No True Scotsman fallacy is, and can't tell the difference between something with intrinsic value and something that doesn't even exist.


Well, Zimbabwe has, and Venezuela, and some others. The point is that we don't want to be there. We know it's bad.


What is obvious is that you can't acknowledge the correct reason why the US left the gold standard.


Delusion. There are no tokens. None exist. Each one is a fiction.


Yes he is.


I am not equating the two. The currency is fictitious. The blockchain could be implemented as a ledger in a notebook.

very quality.

thanks for this.

 

[Into the Night]

Nope. A fiat currency is one whose value is determined solely by the faith of the reciever in exchange for goods and services, i.e. value by fiat with no tangible, intrinsic value otherwsie associated with the currency.

Nope. A fiat currency is one that is designated by fiat, or dictat.

If you and I and a group of friends decide to use GI Joe action figures as currency amongst ourselves, or MAD Magazines, we will have established a fiat currency.

Nope. You will have established GI Joe action figures as a currency. It is not fiat.

Similarly, if we decide to use invisible (nonexistent) "tokens" as currency amongst ourselves, and we keep tabs on who has how many and what transactions have occurred on a spreadsheet, we will have established a fiat currency. If me move our invisible token currency to a laptop and use cryptography to protect the ledger, we will have made our fiat currency a cryptocurrency.

Nope. Blockchain currency is not a fiat currency either.

The fact that there is a ledger that is protected by cryptography does not somehow change the underlying fiat currency.

The blockchain hash algorithm is not a ledger, IBD.

I knew it. You were conflating "fiat currency" with "legal tender."

Nope. Legal tender is any agreed upon currency that law allows, even GI Joe action figures.
The 'legal tender' printed on fiat dollar bills is NOT legal tender, since Congress had no authority to create them.

Congress absolutely has the legal authority to regulate the value of any currency it makes:

Nope. See Article I of the Constitution of the United States. It has authority to set weights and measures when it comes to the legal currency of the United States, that is all.

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

That means setting the weights and measures units, IBD. It does NOT mean it can designate a worth of any ounce of gold or silver.

Alright, let's look at Article I of the Constitution:

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

It doesn't seem to have changed.

Selective lie. The only legal tender in the United States is gold and silver. A dollar is a given weight of gold (at the time, 1/20th of an ounce.

Let's just say that if you were secretly addicted to gambling with crypto and weren't admitting to it, I wouldn't be surprised. You are in Xadoman's camp over all the wrong things.

I am not in Xadoman's camp. I don't even invest in any crypto currency other than the USD. I don't invest in any blockchain currency for the reasons I've already given. Pay attention.

Your EVASION of the exchange is transparent.

I am not evading anything, IBD. Hallucination.

You are right to have lost track; it was a different 'hot' new crypto every couple of months. It started with Safe Moon, with his "What's everybody's 'made it' car?" thread. He was certain he was going to be making 50x-100x in relatively short order. When Safe Moon deflated he didn't miss a beat talking about how exciting Evergrow was looking, then Bull Dog, then others.

I know you don't invest in them because you can't. I asked if you gamble with them in the hopes that this time it won't be a scam ... you know, like Charlie Brown getting up the motivation to kick the ball, that this time there won't be any ball/rug-pull. I'm just wondering.

You keep EVADING the topic of the exchanges.

Repetition fallacy. Lie. Synthesis.

The world is full of stupid people.

True.

...deleted numerous hallucinations...
I don't think anyone elected you to decide which uses were proper blockchain uses. Until you shift your focus to the ways blockchain can be abused on an exchange, regurgitating how great blockchain is doesn't cut it.

I never claimed to decide which blockchain everyone should use.Hallucination.

The general public (including you) does not know how an exchange works, or what a No True Scotsman fallacy is, and can't tell the difference between something with intrinsic value and something that doesn't even exist.

Fallacy fallacy. Buzzword fallacies.

Well, Zimbabwe has, and Venezuela, and some others. The point is that we don't want to be there. We know it's bad.

Guess where the U.S. is headed.

What is obvious is that you can't acknowledge the correct reason why the US left the gold standard.

Sure I can. They were running out of money. Other nations already did.

Delusion. There are no tokens. None exist. Each one is a fiction.

Tokens exist, IBD. You can't make them just disappear.

Yes he is.

I am not equating the two. The currency is fictitious. The blockchain could be implemented as a ledger in a notebook.

You are equating the two.
The blockchain hash algorithm defining the blockchain is not a ledger.

 

[Diogenes]

very quality. thanks for this.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

all the hyteria about porn is hilarious.

Keynesianism is more harmful.

 

[IBDaMann]

Nope. A fiat currency is one that is designated by fiat, or dictat.

Yes, I covered that. The fiat is the value assigned by the receiver in exchange for goods and services.

The blockchain hash algorithm is not a ledger, IBD.

The blockchain is a ledger, just one that uses cryptography for security.
The blockchain cryptography, however, is cryptography, and is not a ledger.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Nope. Legal tender is any agreed upon currency that law allows,

Ooooooh, nope in a big way. Legal tender must be accepted for all debts, public and private.

If you and I and some friends establish a fiat currency of GI Joe action figures, nobody is required to accept our currency for any debt.

even GI Joe action figures.

That's my point.

The 'legal tender' printed on fiat dollar bills is NOT legal tender, since Congress had no authority to create them.

Congress has the power to require they be accepted for payment of all debts, both public and private. If I owe you three GI Joe action figures as payment for engineering services you performed, and you sue me, you will nonetheless win a judgement in legal tender, i.e. dollars. Congress has that power.

Nope. See Article I of the Constitution of the United States. It has authority to set weights and measures when it comes to the legal currency of the United States, that is all.

I can still read English, and regulate the Value thereof speaks to "value" and not to fixing any "standards of weights and measures".

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

Selective lie. The only legal tender in the United States is gold and silver.

§5103. Legal tender​

United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Foreign gold or silver coins are not legal tender for debts.

( Pub. L. 97–258, Sept. 13, 1982, 96 Stat. 980 ; Pub. L. 97–452, §1(19), Jan. 12, 1983, 96 Stat. 2477 .)

A dollar is a given weight of gold (at the time, 1/20th of an ounce.

Nope. A dollar is United States "coins and currency" which is legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.

Guess where the U.S. is headed.

Into the toilet if some serious changes are not made.

Tokens exist, IBD. You can't make them just disappear.

Too funny! I don't need to make anything disappear that doesn't exist in the first place.

Do yourself a favor; fill a bowl with your "tokens" and take a photograph. Post that photo here on JPP in this thread and let's discuss "making them disappear!" Way too funny!

 

[Into the Night]

Yes, I covered that. The fiat is the value assigned by the receiver in exchange for goods and services.

Redefinition fallacy. Fiat is not price discovery.

The blockchain is a ledger, just one that uses cryptography for security.
The blockchain cryptography, however, is cryptography, and is not a ledger.

The blockchain is defined by an algorithm, IBD. It is not a ledger.
The transaction algorithm is the ledger.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Assumption of victory fallacy.

Ooooooh, nope in a big way. Legal tender must be accepted for all debts, public and private.

No, it doesn't. There are many places, for example, that don't accept cash.

If you and I and some friends establish a fiat currency of GI Joe action figures, nobody is required to accept our currency for any debt.

True. Strawman fallacy.

That's my point.

Your point is a strawman fallacy.

Congress has the power to require they be accepted for payment of all debts, both public and private.

No, they don't. See Article I...ALL of Article I.

If I owe you three GI Joe action figures as payment for engineering services you performed, and you sue me, you will nonetheless win a judgement in legal tender, i.e. dollars. Congress has that power.

Congress is not a courtroom.

I can still read English,

I am beginning to doubt that. You are having trouble reading my posts, and you think there is stuff in the Constitution that isn't there by selective lies.

and regulate the Value thereof speaks to "value" and not to fixing any "standards of weights and measures".

It is exactly fixing standards of weights and measures.

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

Still ignoring the rest of Article I. That won't work, IBD.

§5103. Legal tender
United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.

Congress had no such authority.

Foreign gold or silver coins are not legal tender for debts.

Gold is not 'foreign'.
Silver is not 'foreign'.

Gold and silver are the only legal tender in the United States, in accordance with the Constitution of the United States.

Nope. A dollar is United States "coins and currency" which is legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.

A piece of paper is not legal currency in the United States.

Into the toilet if some serious changes are not made.
Too funny! I don't need to make anything disappear that doesn't exist in the first place.

It does exist, IBD. You cannot make it just disappear.

Do yourself a favor; fill a bowl with your "tokens" and take a photograph. Post that photo here on JPP in this thread and let's discuss "making them disappear!" Way too funny!

Not a bowl, IBD. A set.
You cannot make the set disappear.

 

[IBDaMann]

Redefinition fallacy. Fiat is not price discovery.

Redefinition fallacy. Price discovery absolutely is price discovery. "Fiat" is someone's establishment of price. Your attempt to divorce currency from the supply-demand curve is a non-starter.

The blockchain is defined by an algorithm, IBD.

The algorithm is that of a ledger. You can verify this by noting that it logs all transactions.

Say it with me: "Ledger"

It is not a ledger.

Would you care to explain, in your own words, in what way the blockchain is somehow not a ledger?

The transaction algorithm is the ledger.

Incorrect. The transaction function accomplishes transactions. The ledger is where the transactions are logged, i.e. the blockchain.

Assumption of victory fallacy.

It's more of a "happy to help you out" type of thing. I volunteer my time in lots of places. It really is no problem.

No, it doesn't. There are many places, for example, that don't accept cash.

That is not an existing debt. Nobody is obligated to engage in a transaction. However, if you claim that I owe you a debt, then you must accept legal tender in payment of that debt, whether public or private. This goes back to one of our previous discussions about accounting being tied to a currency, and why American accounting records transactions in dollars.

Your point is a strawman fallacy.

You're going to have to do better than that.

No, they don't. See Article I...ALL of Article I.

I see that you are trying to redefine "regulate the Value" to "allow only gold and silver." Let me know how that works out for you.

Congress is not a courtroom.

... nor is Congress peanut butter.

You are having trouble reading my posts,

... only because they are painful to read.

and you think there is stuff in the Constitution that isn't there by selective lies.

How does copy-pasting directly from the Constitution imply that none of it is actually in the Constitution?

Really, let's discuss how ...

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

... really isn't in the Constitution at all. You are referring to Article. I. Section. 8. as "selective lies", yes?

It is exactly fixing standards of weights and measures.

The fixing of the Standard of Weights and Measures is another option available to Congress. The power to fix the Standard of Weights and Measures does not negate Congress' power to coin Money and to regulate the Value thereof,

Congress had no such authority.

It's right there in Article I. Section 8.

Gold and silver are the only legal tender in the United States,

§5103. Legal tender​

United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Foreign gold or silver coins are not legal tender for debts.

If you are wondering whether Congress has been vested Constitutionally with all legislative Powers, and whether those powers include coining Money and regulating the value thereof, I note the following:

Article I​

Section 1: Congress​

All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.

Article I​

Section 8: Powers of Congress​

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof



Hmmmmmmmmm.

A piece of paper is not legal currency in the United States.

... but a piece of cloth is.

Not a bowl, IBD. A set.

Just take a photo of a pile of said tokens and post it here.

You cannot make the set disappear.

Not when it doesn't exist. Post the photo.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

Yes, I covered that. The fiat is the value assigned by the receiver in exchange for goods and services.


The blockchain is a ledger, just one that uses cryptography for security.
The blockchain cryptography, however, is cryptography, and is not a ledger.

Let me know if you have any questions.


Ooooooh, nope in a big way. Legal tender must be accepted for all debts, public and private.

If you and I and some friends establish a fiat currency of GI Joe action figures, nobody is required to accept our currency for any debt.


That's my point.


Congress has the power to require they be accepted for payment of all debts, both public and private. If I owe you three GI Joe action figures as payment for engineering services you performed, and you sue me, you will nonetheless win a judgement in legal tender, i.e. dollars. Congress has that power.


I can still read English, and regulate the Value thereof speaks to "value" and not to fixing any "standards of weights and measures".

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

§5103. Legal tender​

United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Foreign gold or silver coins are not legal tender for debts.

( Pub. L. 97–258, Sept. 13, 1982, 96 Stat. 980 ; Pub. L. 97–452, §1(19), Jan. 12, 1983, 96 Stat. 2477 .)



Nope. A dollar is United States "coins and currency" which is legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.


Into the toilet if some serious changes are not made.


Too funny! I don't need to make anything disappear that doesn't exist in the first place.

Do yourself a favor; fill a bowl with your "tokens" and take a photograph. Post that photo here on JPP in this thread and let's discuss "making them disappear!" Way too funny!

yes. delusion may be government enforced or just naturally occurring.

 

[Into the Night]

Redefinition fallacy. Price discovery absolutely is price discovery.

:

"Fiat" is someone's establishment of price. Your attempt to divorce currency from the supply-demand curve is a non-starter.

Redefinition fallacies. Price discovery is not a currency. A market is not a currency.

The algorithm is that of a ledger.

The algorithm defining a blockchain currency is not a ledger.

You can verify this by noting that it logs all transactions.

The algorithm defining a blockchain does not log any transaction.

Say it with me: "Ledger"

Would you care to explain, in your own words, in what way the blockchain is somehow not a ledger?

I already did. RQAA

Incorrect. The transaction function accomplishes transactions.

That is not the algorithm defining the blockchain.

The ledger is where the transactions are logged, i.e. the blockchain.

The algorithm defining a blockchain currency is not a ledger and contains no transactions.

It's more of a "happy to help you out" type of thing. I volunteer my time in lots of places. It really is no problem.

You can't help. You do not understand currency. You have already shown confusion of:
currency<->price discovery
currency<->market
currency<->wealth
blockchain definition algorithm<->ledger
blockchain definition algorithm<->transaction
blockchain currency<->ponzi scheme
basket currency<->blockchain currency
paper<->legal tender
accounting<->currency

What a currency is and what it does.

That is not an existing debt. Nobody is obligated to engage in a transaction. However, if you claim that I owe you a debt, then you must accept legal tender in payment of that debt, whether public or private. This goes back to one of our previous discussions about accounting being tied to a currency, and why American accounting records transactions in dollars.

Paradox.Irrational. Attempted proof by strange loop.

You're going to have to do better than that.

I see that you are trying to redefine "regulate the Value" to "allow only gold and silver." Let me know how that works out for you.

Go read the Constitution, IBD.

... nor is Congress peanut butter.

Strawman fallacy. Trivial fallacy.

... only because they are painful to read.

Hallucination.

How does copy-pasting directly from the Constitution imply that none of it is actually in the Constitution?

Attempted proof by selective.

Really, let's discuss how ...

US Constitution: Article. I. Section. 8.
To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

... really isn't in the Constitution at all. You are referring to Article. I. Section. 8. as "selective lies", yes?


The fixing of the Standard of Weights and Measures is another option available to Congress. The power to fix the Standard of Weights and Measures does not negate Congress' power to coin Money and to regulate the Value thereof,


It's right there in Article I. Section 8.

Fixation. Attempted proof by selective.

... but a piece of cloth is.

What piece of cloth?

Just take a photo of a pile of said tokens and post it here.

Not when it doesn't exist. Post the photo.

RQAA

 

[IBDaMann]

What piece of cloth?

Money is cloth.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

A currency is not a value. It is a store of value. It is also a unit of account.
Any currency, whether it is fiat, gold, silver, BitCoin, etc. is nothing more than a medium of barter.

The items barters are the real value. It is what people want and need.

no.

sound money is backed by some other commodity.

sound money is a real concept.

 

[Into the Night]

Money is cloth.

Cloth can be used as money, but you are getting into strawman fallacies again.

 

[Into the Night]

no.

sound money is backed by some other commodity.

sound money is a real concept.

Sounds like you invest in paper gold.
It's a scam. There is no gold behind it.

 

[Jerry Mathers]

Sounds like you invest in paper gold.
It's a scam. There is no gold behind it.

no it doesn't.

 

[Into the Night]

no it doesn't.

Then what commodity do you choose?