For those who love to blame boomers for EVERYTHING wrong in the country....

walts just another noecon globalist race to the bottom dehumanizer.

he cant even hide it he's so full of hate and arrogance.

this is Satan, ladies and gentlemints.

Walt = satan
 
I could not agree more. It is disturbingly low, and pushing down the low end of the wage range. It lowers investment in training, and any attempts to retain employees. It is becoming a mess.


We can't even get basic income, so I doubt universal basic income is anywhere in the offing in America.
Stuck on welfare, eh? Whadda loser.
I generally feel that people need something in their lives, so I am cautious about UBI. But The Epstein Class' total disregard for it is disturbing.

Maybe the solution is the guaranteed part time job. Or maybe it is a strict, real UBI. Or maybe a basic income for those that make less than a certain amount of money. Or maybe a top up on having a job.

I do not have all the answers, but I know the Epstein Class is working against any of the answers.
No, Wally. Democrats HAVE NO answers.
 
Well, I called this one right:
Now queue a bunch of alt right posters saying they assume construction is easy to learn, because they have never done it, and anything they have never done must be easy.
its not that hard for the average grunt. its basically manual labor, and not being an idiot.

labor glut, lower wages.
The shortage is construction workers is the exact opposite of a labor glut. The low wages have led to a labor shortage.
 
Well, I called this one right:




The shortage is construction workers is the exact opposite of a labor glut. The low wages have led to a labor shortage.
no.
dummy. the point of all the immigration is to drive down wages via a labor glut.

maybe you don't understand economy terms.
 
ziomongo-jpeg.93557


:eek2: That's @Guno צְבִי. Where'd you find it, Jerry?
 
there has been a labor shortage ever since wages were driven down

Has there been a labor shortage ever since wages were driven down by immigration?




No. There has not been a continuous labor shortage ever since immigration put downward pressure on some wages. Labor-market tightness comes and goes with the business cycle, demographics, and policy; immigration increases labor supply, which tends to ease shortages even as it can restrain wages for competing workers.

The two parts of the question pull in opposite directions economically. Extra workers (immigrants) expand the labor force. That should fill vacancies and moderate wage growth, not create a permanent shortage. Recurring employer claims of “shortages” often reflect a preference for wages below what would attract enough native-born workers.

Wage effects of immigration are modest and concentrated​

The National Academies of Sciences 2017 review concluded that immigration’s overall effect on native-born wages is very small; any negative effects fall mainly on earlier immigrants and U.S.-born high-school dropouts.

George Borjas and co-authors find larger substitution effects: a 10% increase in workers in a given skill group reduces wages of similar natives by roughly 3–4%. Because many immigrants have low education, this hits high-school dropouts and prior immigrants hardest. CIS analyses of 2012–2022 data show faster real wage growth for less-educated U.S.-born workers during the lower-immigration years 2016–2019 than in higher-immigration periods before and after.

Other work emphasizes complementarity. Recent national-level estimates covering 2000–2023 (Caiumi and Peri) find that immigration, given its skill mix and occupational upgrading by natives, raised wages of less-educated natives by about 1.7–3.4% over that period, with little or no crowding-out of native employment. Short-run local effects can look different from long-run national ones after capital adjusts and firms expand.

The literature is not unanimous. Low-skilled immigration does put downward pressure on wages of the closest substitutes. The size of that pressure is debated and is smaller than popular claims of wholesale wage collapse.

Labor shortages have been episodic, not permanent​

U.S. unemployment and job-openings data show no unbroken shortage stretching back decades. Pre-COVID, the late-2010s labor market was tight (unemployment near 3.5%, openings around 7 million). The 2021–2022 post-COVID period was unusually tight: openings peaked near 12 million while unemployment stayed low. Many sectors that employ large numbers of immigrants (hospitality, construction, agriculture, some manufacturing) reported acute shortages then.

The 2021–2024 immigration surge helped fill those openings, raised measured job growth, and cooled wage growth in immigrant-heavy industries—exactly what extra labor supply should do. Federal Reserve analyses from Dallas and Kansas City document this cooling effect. By mid-2026, openings had fallen to roughly 7.4 million, unemployment was about 4.1%, and the openings-to-unemployed ratio hovered near 1. That is a normal-to-moderately-tight market, not a chronic shortage.

Agriculture and construction have claimed shortages for decades whenever enforcement rises or inflows slow. Employers in those sectors often respond by raising wages modestly or shifting practices rather than facing empty fields or job sites indefinitely. When immigration enforcement increased in some periods, native employment and wages in those sectors did not automatically surge; adjustment takes time and depends on wages offered.

Why the “shortage after wage suppression” story does not hold​

If immigration had driven wages so low that natives left those jobs, the logical result would be more vacancies until wages rose enough to draw people back. Instead, high-immigration periods have generally been associated with fewer vacancies and slower wage growth in the affected occupations. The opposite pattern—tight markets and faster low-skill wage growth—appeared during lower-inflow windows such as 2016–2019 and parts of the post-Great Recession years.

Demographics matter independently: slowing native labor-force growth (aging, lower participation) creates tightness that immigration can offset. That is a labor-supply issue, not proof that prior wage suppression created a permanent shortage. Technology, trade, and education trends also shape low-skill wages.

In short, immigration has modestly restrained wages for some competing low-skilled natives in certain periods. It has not produced a labor shortage that has lasted “ever since.” Markets have tightened and loosened for the usual reasons; extra immigrant labor has more often filled jobs than created unfilled ones.


 
Has there been a labor shortage ever since wages were driven down by immigration?
Wages were driven down by the lack of collective bargaining, not by immigrants.

Immigrants have kept the entire system from collapsing, but there have been severe labor shortages since the 1970's.
 
Wages were driven down by the lack of collective bargaining, not by immigrants.

Immigrants have kept the entire system from collapsing, but there have been severe labor shortages since the 1970's.
wages are an ongoing dynamic process affected by supply and demand.

a labor glut always drives wages down.

supply and demand says a shortage should drive up wages.

what is the ratio of wages to cost of living? jew plantation owner fuck?
 
Wages were driven down by the lack of collective bargaining, not by immigrants. Immigrants have kept the entire system from collapsing, but there have been severe labor shortages since the 1970's.


Walt’s post says wages fell because of weaker collective bargaining, not immigration, and that there have been “severe labor shortages since the 1970s” that immigrants kept from collapsing the system.


Union decline is a real and large factor. Private-sector union density fell from about 24% in 1973 to roughly 6% today. That reduced workers’ bargaining power, especially for production and lower-skill jobs, and contributed to slower wage growth for those groups. Employer resistance, weaker labor-law enforcement, right-to-work laws, the shift out of manufacturing, and globalization all played roles. That part of Walt’s argument is on solid ground.


It does not follow that immigration was irrelevant. Increased low-skilled labor supply and weaker unions can operate at the same time. Some research even finds that immigrant inflows themselves reduced natives’ incentives to organize. The two explanations are not mutually exclusive.


The “severe labor shortages since the 1970s” claim does not match the data. Unemployment was high for long stretches of that period:


  • Mid-1970s: 8.5% (1975)
  • Early 1980s: peaked at 10.8% (1982)
  • Early 1990s recession
  • Early 2000s
  • Great Recession: 9.3–9.6% (2009–2010)
  • 2020 pandemic spike

Tight markets appeared later (late 1990s, 2018–2019, 2021–2023). Those were cyclical expansions, not a 50-year unbroken shortage. JOLTS-style vacancy data only go back reliably to 2000 and also show cycles, not a permanent shortage starting in the 1970s.


Immigrants have accounted for a large share of labor-force growth as native fertility fell and the baby boom aged out. That is a demographic fact, and slower labor-force growth would have constrained output. Calling that “kept the entire system from collapsing” is rhetorical. The economy experienced multiple recessions, high unemployment, and wage stagnation for lower-skill natives during the same decades immigration rose.


In short: weaker unions mattered for wages. Immigration also affected supply in competing occupations. Neither produced a continuous labor shortage dating to the 1970s. Labor markets tightened and slackened with the cycle; extra immigrant labor more often filled jobs than created a permanent vacancy crisis.
 
unions were beaten out of the private sector by violent oligarchs and organized crime figures.

No, they destroyed themselves. You had self-serving union leaders who were into graft and self-promotion. You have unions that charge dues and then hand most of those over to politicians that many of the union's membership hate. You have unions that do nothing to help you get promoted or a better position with the company. There's a plethora of reasons why unions failed their members.
now the only unions are government and they are out of control.

They too will eventually die off due to their own stupidity.
in the past unions WERE necessary and DID create the middle class.

In the past unions were a necessity in many industries. They didn't build the Middle Class so much as stopped the worst of exploitation of workers.
there was no magical mythical occurrence of capitalism raising all boats.

Sure there is. The whole of Western civilization is built on Capitalism. Socialism, Tribalism, Communism, none of that built the Western world.
 
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