New critical race theory laws have teachers scared, confused and self-censoring

AProudLefty said:
It is not about teaching them your societal values. It's about teaching them that everyone is equal. "All men are created equal." Remember? Are you saying the teachers shouldn't teach students the Founding Fathers religious and societal values? :dunno:
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It's about the fact they have a first amendment right to measure societal values differently than you and I do. That you want to bootstomp your moral code onto children by trying to pretend it isn't a moral code because you call it societal doesn't change that as a government entity it is not the government's place to present your values above those of another.

What's more worrying to me is the fact that you would have to make sure everyone you hired also had those same beliefs because in your world teachers get to teach children their values, but only if they match yours. In my world you get to teach your kids your values and the teachers do not. You simply have teachers teaching math, science, reading... not something as vague as your moral values.
 
Damocles said:
It's about the fact they have a first amendment right to measure societal values differently than you and I do. That you want to bootstomp your moral code onto children by trying to pretend it isn't a moral code because you call it societal doesn't change that as a government entity it is not the government's place to present your values above those of another.
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Yes they do have the right to measure societal values differently. We also have the right to reject them if they do not treat us with respect and equally. It's how it works. Would you want to hire someone who won't treat your employees with respect and as equals because they are different?

Let's say the teachers don't teach them anything about values. What to do with those students who don't treat others with respect and as equals? Yes, eliminate them. Let parents take care of them.

What's more worrying to me is the fact that you would have to make sure everyone you hired also had those same beliefs because in your world teachers get to teach children their values, but only if they match yours. In my world you get to teach your kids your values and the teachers do not. You simply have teachers teaching math, science, reading... not something as vague as your moral values.
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I do not want them taught my moral values. But they can ask teachers though. Sometimes I asked my teachers about their values and beliefs. Nothing's wrong with that. When it comes to CRA and the Holocaust, we have to ask ourselves why it happened and why the values are different. Why do some people believe that it was nothing wrong with how they treated the blacks and the Jews? Those types of analyses are good.
 
AProudLefty said:
Yes they do have the right to measure societal values differently. We also have the right to reject them if they do not treat us with respect and equally. It's how it works. Would you want to hire someone who won't treat your employees with respect and as equals because they are different?
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We do that by making rules against actions, not by valuing your moral code over theirs.
Let's say the teachers don't teach them anything about values. What to do with those students who don't treat others with respect and as equals? Yes, eliminate them. Let parents take care of them.
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We do as we always have done, we punish them for actions, not for beliefs.

I do not want them taught my moral values. But they can ask teachers though. Sometimes I asked my teachers about their values and beliefs. Nothing's wrong with that. When it comes to CRA and the Holocaust, we have to ask ourselves why it happened and why the values are different. Why do some people believe that it was nothing wrong with how they treated the blacks and the Jews? Those types of analyses are good.
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But you do, it's what you have been saying this whole time. In order for them to give the answers you want them to give they must be taught to respond in your value code, not their own. I prefer them to say, ask your father... in my area of the world they'd be preaching Christian values and those are not mine.
 
Damocles said:
We do as we always have done, we punish them for actions, not for beliefs.
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That's just it. Sometimes their actions are guided by their beliefs and values. They used to believe that Blacks were inferior so any action against them were deemed okay. So in other words we DO punish them for beliefs. It's the same thing with the LGBT students. Some parents teach them that it's wrong and against the Bible so the students bully against them based on that beliefs and values.

But you do, it's what you have been saying this whole time. In order for them to give the answers you want them to give they must be taught to respond in your value code, not their own. I prefer them to say, ask your father... in my area of the world they'd be preaching Christian values and those are not mine.
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No I don't. All I want is for them to understand that all human beings are equals, just like the Founding Fathers wanted.
 
AProudLefty said:
That's just it. Sometimes their actions are guided by their beliefs and values. They used to believe that Blacks were inferior so any action against them were deemed okay. So in other words we DO punish them for beliefs. It's the same thing with the LGBT students. Some parents teach them that it's wrong and against the Bible so the students bully against them based on that beliefs and values.



No I don't. All I want is for them to understand that all human beings are equals, just like the Founding Fathers wanted.
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No. You want to ensure teachers feed your "social values" to the children and not their own if it doesn't mesh with yours.

And yes. Some religions allow for sacrifices, but the action of murder is a crime. We punish them for the action, not their beliefs.

It is always the action we should punish for, because giving your belief system more value than another you disagree with is something forbidden by the 1st amendment.
 
Damocles said:
No. You want to ensure teachers feed your "social values" to the children and not their own if it doesn't mesh with yours.

And yes. Some religions allow for sacrifices, but the action of murder is a crime. We punish them for the action, not their beliefs.

It is always the action we should punish for, because giving your belief system more value than another you disagree with is something forbidden by the 1st amendment.
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Well we do agree on something: expel those students if they don't behave. Let their parents take care of them. Sad but it's the reality. We are way behind in education in the world.

idiocracy-test.gif
 
Flash said:
And it just gave all those slaves away for free? Or, were you agreeing it was for money?
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I'm on board that it was for Money.

"The Opium Wars were two wars waged between the Qing dynasty and Western powers in the mid-19th century. The First Opium War, fought in 1839–1842 between Qing China and the United Kingdom, was triggered by the dynasty's campaign against the British merchants who sold opium in China. Wikipedia'

Britain as a Drug Cartel. All about the Money.
 
Flash said:
We don't have to decide which is "worse" when we can condemn both. We do not have to divide everything into worse or better.
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Well in life you don't need to take a position on anything. if that's what you want. There is definitely good and bad in this world and all degrees of both. I have no problem defining what I think is better or worse.
 
Damocles said:
No. You want to ensure teachers feed your "social values" to the children and not their own if it doesn't mesh with yours.

.
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This is the core of the angst over "critical race theory". It assumes that teaching history is "feeding social values". The fact is the elements of critical race theory - the idea that slavery was justified by belief in racial inferiority, that racial discrimination has long been rampant in this country - are not at all new. These are facts, not values unless they are turned into values, which is the fear of CRT not CRT itself.
 
Lionfish said:
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Indeed.

CRT has turned blue to red in Virginia and will turn the House to red in November.

That, along with crime, inflation, and the border will turn America red.

The agenda of the radical, far left Democrat Socialists is being rejected by the American people.

Finally!
 
jbander said:
Well in life you don't need to take a position on anything. if that's what you want. There is definitely good and bad in this world and all degrees of both. I have no problem defining what I think is better or worse.
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When we define what is good and bad based on our partisan political views it is no different than the other side. They are also defining what is good and bad but it is usually the opposite from ours. Both sides are based on subjective opinion.

And, when our subjective evaluations are based on false assumptions any determination of good and evil are useless. For example, your original response to my post was far afield from reality but you truly believe you were differentiating good from evil although based on totally false perceptions.
 
Flash said:
When we define what is good and bad based on our partisan political views it is no different than the other side. They are also defining what is good and bad but it is usually the opposite from ours. Both sides are based on subjective opinion.

And, when our subjective evaluations are based on false assumptions any determination of good and evil are useless. For example, your original response to my post was far afield from reality but you truly believe you were differentiating good from evil although based on totally false perceptions.
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Funny , if you say so, not that anyone has a clue what you are talking about. like I said I have no problem defining what I think is better or worse.
 
jbander said:
Funny , if you say so, not that anyone has a clue what you are talking about. like I said I have no problem defining what I think is better or worse.
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Too many polysyllabic words?

I understood it.

He even explained his position perfectly.
 
Earl said:
Too many polysyllabic words?

I understood it.

He even explained his position perfectly.
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well then good tell me what this is " your original response to my post was far afield from reality but you truly believe you were differentiating good from evil although based on totally false perceptions."
 
jbander said:
Funny , if you say so, not that anyone has a clue what you are talking about. like I said I have no problem defining what I think is better or worse.
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I was talking about your response to me that was snippy and based on completely false assumptions. You can only decide what is better or worse if you have an accurate picture of the situation. When you make unwarranted conclusions based on knee-jerk reactions you often make poor decisions.
 
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