Oklahoma Bible mandate challenged in Court

Cypress said:
Correct. Teaching is not the same as promoting.
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Except it kinda is, and kinda becomes that.

I'm thinking about the USA as it exists in 2026. I don't know what you are thinking, but in America 2026 the Religious Right is in ascendence. They've eliminated legal abortions in many states and are now coming after birth control, same sex marriage etc.

If you think that what is going on in Oklahoma is going to be some milquetoast survey of religious thought I've got a bridge to sell you.


That's the reality. And you are, as per usual, dishonestly covering for your faith. You whitewash the religious right's aggressive tactics which are destroying America.
 
murph63 said:
They've eliminated legal abortions in many states and are now coming after birth control, same sex marriage etc.
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That has nothing to do with religious studies classes in public colleges and highschool AP classes.

Those are the decisions of five men on the Supreme Court. That's a political question, not an educational question.

I would oppose any attempt to censor religious studies classes at the State-supported University of California. A college undergraduate has the right to take a class on Buddhism if they desire.

Any attempt to censor these classes will be considered Authoritarian by me 👉

University of California - Davis Religious Studies Curriculum​

RST 023 — Introduction to Judaism

RST 031 — Introduction to Jainism

RST 034 — Introduction to Buddhism

RST 045 — Christianity

RST 060 — Introduction to Islam

RST 068 — Introduction to Hinduism

RST 040 — New Testament

RST 065C — The Qur'an & Its Interpretation
 
murph63 said:
Except it kinda is, and kinda becomes that.

I'm thinking about the USA as it exists in 2026. I don't know what you are thinking, but in America 2026 the Religious Right is in ascendence. They've eliminated legal abortions in many states and are now coming after birth control, same sex marriage etc. That's the reality.
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I've never heard of a reputable public university that offers classes actively promoting evangelical Christian nationalism.

Throwing out the baby with the bathwater has always been a stupid idea. It doesn't follow that because five guys on the Supreme Court overturned Roe it means we have to eliminate all college religious studies classes on Buddhism, the New Testament, and Hinduism.

murph63 said:
If you think that what is going on in Oklahoma is going to be some milquetoast survey of religious thought I've got a bridge to sell you.
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I have never supported laws that actually promote Christianity in state funded schools.

I also don't like radicals trying to take away the choice of kids at the University of California to take a religious studies class on Buddhism, Christianity, or Judaism if they desire
 
Cypress said:
That has nothing to do with religious studies classes in public colleges and highschool AP classes.

Those are the decisions of five men on the Supreme Court. That's a political question, not an educational question.

I would oppose any attempt to censor religious studies classes at the State-supported University of California. A college undergraduate has the right to take a class on Buddhism if they desire.

Any attempt to censor these classes will be considered Authoritarian by me 👉

University of California - Davis Religious Studies Curriculum​

RST 023 — Introduction to Judaism

RST 031 — Introduction to Jainism

RST 034 — Introduction to Buddhism

RST 045 — Christianity

RST 060 — Introduction to Islam

RST 068 — Introduction to Hinduism

RST 040 — New Testament

RST 065C — The Qur'an & Its Interpretation
Click to expand...

I wish you were an honest interlocutor. Then you would have responded as such to my point.

The demand to teach the Bible in Oklahoma is NOT the same as the University of California Davis curriculum.

It is a naked attempt by religious zealots to force America into a Christo-fascist dictatorship.

That's what's at stake here. Not "Comparative Religions".
 
Cypress said:
You don't teach doctrine, practice, and sacrament. You teach at the level of cultural history.


No, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism can be discussed at the level of history and culture
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Unconstitutional! America has freedom of religion, even the ones,you don't like ,or are a scared of!
Keep religion out of public schools!
Organized pray too!
 
Cypress said:
My super-liberal public university offers classes on the history of Christianity, and I oppose any attempts to censor the school and take away that educational opportunity for students who desire it.

I am certain that my super-liberal public university also offers courses on Islam, Buddhism, and Judaism and I consider any effort to censor those classes to be authoritarian. I'd take a class on Judaism if I had the time and opportunity.
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College electives, aren't like mandatory religion in Grade and HS ,like Texas wants
 
murph63 said:
I wish you were an honest interlocutor!
Click to expand...
I already said I am against any school policy that promotes Christian practice, rather than teaches it at the level of history and culture.

But the most interesting thing about this thread is you have basically grudgingly admitted the following religious studies classes are perfectly legitimate in public universities and highschool AP classes:

RST 023 — Introduction to Judaism

RST 031 — Introduction to Jainism

RST 034 — Introduction to Buddhism

RST 045 — Christianity

RST 060 — Introduction to Islam

RST 068 — Introduction to Hinduism

RST 040 — New Testament

RST 065C — The Qur'an & Its Interpretation
 
Melchizedek=Tecumseh said:
Unconstitutional! America has freedom of religion, even the ones,you don't like ,or are a scared of!
Keep religion out of public schools!
Organized pray too!
Click to expand...
Religious Studies classes have always been legal and legitimate in state-supported public universities. There is absolutely no reason for radicals to prevent a University of California student from taking a class on Hinduism or Judaism, if they desire. I don't see any reason these kind of religious studies classes can't be offered as AP classes in high school.

University of California offers a comprehensive slate of religious studies classes, and UC is not known as a conservative right-wing educational system.

OTOH, Classes that promotes the practice of a religion, rather than teaching at the level of cultural history, would definitely be unconstitutional
 
Cypress said:
Religious Studies classes have always been legal and legitimate in state-supported public universities. There is absolutely no reason for radicals to prevent a University of California student from taking a class on Hinduism or Judaism, if they desire. I don't see any reason these kind of religious studies classes can't be offered as AP classes in high school.

University of California offers a comprehensive slate of religious studies classes, and UC is not known as a conservative right-wing educational system.

OTOH, Classes that promotes the practice of a religion, rather than teaching at the level of cultural history, would definitely be unconstitutional
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University is different than Grade school and High school ,mandatory classes,like Texas is pushing
 
Melchizedek=Tecumseh said:
University is different than Grade school and High school ,mandatory classes,like Texas is pushing
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You stated we need to keep religion out of public school. You didn't carve out special exceptions for elective classes or age level.

Explain what this huge difference is between a 19 year old college freshman enrolling in an Introduction to Buddhism class, versus an 18 year old highschool senior enrolling in an Introduction to Buddhism AP class.
 
Cypress said:
I already said I am against any school policy that promotes Christian practice, rather than teaches it at the level of history and culture.

But the most interesting thing about this thread is you have basically grudgingly admitted the following religious studies classes are perfectly legitimate in public universities and highschool AP classes:

RST 023 — Introduction to Judaism

RST 031 — Introduction to Jainism

RST 034 — Introduction to Buddhism

RST 045 — Christianity

RST 060 — Introduction to Islam

RST 068 — Introduction to Hinduism

RST 040 — New Testament

RST 065C — The Qur'an & Its Interpretation
Click to expand...

And I'm not really arguing against your position. Learning comparative religion is fine. The topic OF THE THREAD, the Oklahoma case is an example of where religion IS being forced into schools.
 
murph63 said:
I wish you were an honest interlocutor. Then you would have responded as such to my point.

The demand to teach the Bible in Oklahoma is NOT the same as the University of California Davis curriculum.

It is a naked attempt by religious zealots to force America into a Christo-fascist dictatorship.

That's what's at stake here. Not "Comparative Religions".
Click to expand...
What is a 'Christo-fascist dictatorship'?
 
murph63 said:
Except it kinda is, and kinda becomes that.

I'm thinking about the USA as it exists in 2026. I don't know what you are thinking, but in America 2026 the Religious Right is in ascendence. They've eliminated legal abortions in many states and are now coming after birth control, same sex marriage etc.

If you think that what is going on in Oklahoma is going to be some milquetoast survey of religious thought I've got a bridge to sell you.


That's the reality. And you are, as per usual, dishonestly covering for your faith. You whitewash the religious right's aggressive tactics which are destroying America.
Click to expand...
You don't own any bridge. You can't sell what you don't own. I doubt you even know how to construct one.

Of course, people do buy and sell bridges.

What is 'religious right'?
How does Jesus Christ destroy America??

Did you know it's completely legal to teach religion in schools?
 
And yet the Buddhist just peacefully trundle along secure in their beliefs and practices ... Native folk of America, Australia and New Zealand hold onto what they haven't lost to colonialism. while the rest of the world's major "faiths" race towards global disaster. 🙄
 
Taichiliberal said:
And yet the Buddhist just peacefully trundle along secure in their beliefs and practices ... Native folk of America, Australia and New Zealand hold onto what they haven't lost to colonialism. while the rest of the world's major "faiths" race towards global disaster. 🙄
Click to expand...
What 'global disaster'? Wouldn't a global disaster also be a disaster for native Americans, Australia, and New Zealand?
 
murph63 said:
And I'm not really arguing against your position. Learning comparative religion is fine. The topic OF THE THREAD, the Oklahoma case is an example of where religion IS being forced into schools.
Click to expand...
The Oklahoma Bible mandate has supposedly been rescinded:

'Mandate Rescinded: In October 2025, the newly appointed state superintendent, Lindel Fields, officially rescinded the order and stated there were no plans to distribute Bibles or mandate biblical curriculum in classrooms."​

The corollary topic introduced in this thread is whether or not any religion should be taught in state-supported schools. I think it is dangerously authoritarian to say we must censor and prohibit religious studies classes on Hinduism, Judaism, Buddhism, or Christianity in public colleges or as highschool AP classes.
 
Cypress said:
Correct. Teaching is not the same as promoting.

A highschool or college can teach the history of Communism or the history of Nazi Germany without promoting Communism or Naziism.
Click to expand...

Agree that there is a gap between teaching *about* something and teaching it in a promotional manner. The Fundies/ Evangelists who are pushing nonsense like this business in Oklahoma want the latter, of course. Even to the point of spending public money on Bibles to distribute to the students. Thankfully that is dead now.
 
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