The Republican War on Science Continues --- OPEN DISCUSSION

[gfm7175]

Good ol' Owl... The Liberal pathogen has infected her quite severely, I'm afraid... Pulling this one out of the 'Chamber of Echos' for open discussion... Here is Owl's OP in its entirety...

"WASHINGTON — The Trump administration is preparing to significantly limit the scientific and medical research that the government can use to determine public health regulations, overriding protests from scientists and physicians who say the new rule would undermine the scientific underpinnings of government policymaking.

A new draft of the Environmental Protection Agency proposal, titled Strengthening Transparency in Regulatory Science, would require that scientists disclose all of their raw data, including confidential medical records, before the agency could consider an academic study’s conclusions. E.P.A. officials called the plan a step toward transparency and said the disclosure of raw data would allow conclusions to be verified independently."
***
"Public health experts warned that studies that have been used for decades — to show, for example, that mercury from power plants impairs brain development, or that lead in paint dust is tied to behavioral disorders in children — might be inadmissible when existing regulations come up for renewal.

For instance, a groundbreaking 1993 Harvard University project that definitively linked polluted air to premature deaths, currently the foundation of the nation’s air-quality laws, could become inadmissible. When gathering data for their research, known as the Six Cities study, scientists signed confidentiality agreements to track the private medical and occupational histories of more than 22,000 people in six cities. They combined that personal data with home air-quality data to study the link between chronic exposure to air pollution and mortality.

But the fossil fuel industry and some Republican lawmakers have long criticized the analysis and a similar study by the American Cancer Society, saying the underlying data sets of both were never made public, preventing independent analysis of the conclusions."

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/11/climate/epa-science-trump.html

 

[gfm7175]

Here, we see yet another prime example of someone who is completely unable to form argumentation on their own, thus they must rely on other people to form their arguments for them.

"WASHINGTON — The Trump administration is preparing to significantly limit the scientific and medical research that the government can use to determine public health regulations, overriding protests from scientists and physicians who say the new rule would undermine the scientific underpinnings of government policymaking.

Legislation is not science.

A new draft of the Environmental Protection Agency proposal, titled Strengthening Transparency in Regulatory Science, would require that scientists disclose all of their raw data, including confidential medical records, before the agency could consider an academic study’s conclusions.

Yes, raw data is important. Statistical Mathematics REQUIRES the use of raw data for any statistical summary.

But the fossil fuel industry and some Republican lawmakers have long criticized the analysis and a similar study by the American Cancer Society, saying the underlying data sets of both were never made public, preventing independent analysis of the conclusions."

Yes, that is an issue.

There is no such thing as the "fossil fuel industry". We do not use fossils for fuel. There are many better fuel alternatives, such as coal, oil, natural gas, nuclear, hydro.....

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/11/climate/epa-science-trump.html

Learn how to form your own arguments, instead of regurgitating what the NY Times says...

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

I hope someone will come play in your sandbox with you, poor thing.

Today, 10:44 AM
gfm7175
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Today, 11:13 AM
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[Cypress]

.......................................................

The reason you are not invited to discuss science with sentient beings, is because you are arrogant and uninformed enough to claim you know more about science than the prestigious U.S. National Academies of Sciences.

>> https://www.justplainpolitics.com/s...enial-Runs-Red-and-Blue&p=2947253#post2947253

 

[gfm7175]

I suppose one way of replacing the elderly in your base who are passing away

Bigotry. There are Republicans of all ages.

is to make new supporters by exposing the young to IQ-impairing lead, mercury, pollutants, asbestos, etc. eh?

Exposing people to lead, mercury, etc. makes them vote Republican?? WTF??

We have to get this evil creature out of our White House before he causes any more damage.

Now you're resorting to dehumanizing Trump, eh? Nah, he is a human, all the same.

What "damage" has he caused?

 

[gfm7175]

I have always felt conservative's most admirable contribution to scientific inquiry is the prestigious Creation Science Museum in beautiful Petersburg, Kentucky

Mostly religion.

 

[gfm7175]

The people that once tried to keep the ship afloat have all left the White House.

Which "people" are you referring to?

This poor idiot is now at the Helm all by himself.

Insult Fallacy. Trump has many people surrounding and advising him, actually.

(We are now at the Mercy of God)

Just now?? Not anytime prior to now?

 

[gfm7175]

My dad was a scientist

I don't believe you.

and most of our neighbors (all transferred to the St. Louis area by their employer) were as well.

I don't believe you.

Back then (R)s supported science and scientific research.

They still do.

Scientific R&D was seen as one of our best weapons against the USSR. It was the anti-establishment left who condemned companies like Dow, Monsanto, Boeing, Standard Oil, etc. for developing war materiel and destroying the environment.

What destruction of the environment?

Science was looked on with suspicion and hatred by many on the left.

It still is.

Now it's totally reversed.

Nope, nothing has changed.

 

[gfm7175]

They might disdain science and technology in the abstract,

Nope, that's the Liberals. Inversion Fallacy.

but I haven't noticed any lack of conservative enjoyment of the products that science and tech bring us, have you?

Both conservatives and liberals tend to enjoy the technological advances that we have made.

They don't go to church instead of the ER when they're having an MI.

The church and the ER serve two different purposes.

They all seem to have cell phones, flat screen TVs, newer cars, Internet, cable.

Yup. So do liberals, thanks to capitalism. What's your point?

They definitely breathe the same clean air and drink the same clean water the rest of us do.

Yup. So do liberals, thanks to capitalism. What's your point?

Well, for now. I wonder how many brain-damaged children, burning rivers, and carcinomas will be needed for them to see the light?

Children are/become brain-damaged for numerous reasons. I thought your thread was about science... Why are you discussing religion??

 

[gfm7175]

I thought this thread was about the "Republican war on science"?? Instead, it's been mainly Trump bashing and Christian bashing... What does any of that have to do with science?? I digress...

Everything about this administration reeks.

Everything? Trump passing the 'Right to Try' bill is something that "reeks"?? Trump bringing troops back home "reeks"?? The record-setting lowering of unemployment rates "reeks"? A booming economy and stock market "reeks"? C'mon now...

Thankfully it will all be over soon,

What will be over soon?

albeit after quite a bit of damage to society.

What "damage to society"??

 

[gfm7175]

Let's hope most of the damage can be mitigated by keeping his insane orders tied up in the courts till sanity can resume.

What "damage"?? What "insane orders"?? The court system is not an Oligarchy. Define "sanity".

 

[gfm7175]

He's stacked the courts pretty well. Certain demographics were warned about the '16 election, and the courts. They couldn't be bothered to vote because....Sanders.

The DNC sure fucked him over, didn't they?

 

[gfm7175]

I hope someone will come play in your sandbox with you, poor thing.

Today, 10:44 AM
gfm7175
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Today, 11:13 AM
gfm7175
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This message is hidden because gfm7175 is on your ignore list.

No worries. Since I have now created this open discussion thread, your echo chamber thread will be dead in no time...

 

[gfm7175]

The reason you are not invited to discuss science with sentient beings, is because you are arrogant and uninformed enough to claim you know more about science than the prestigious U.S. National Academies of Sciences.

>> https://www.justplainpolitics.com/s...enial-Runs-Red-and-Blue&p=2947253#post2947253

I DO know more about science than the USNAS. I've told you this many times. I'm not going to back down from my claim.

 

[domer76]

Here, we see yet another prime example of someone who is completely unable to form argumentation on their own, thus they must rely on other people to form their arguments for them.


Legislation is not science.


Yes, raw data is important. Statistical Mathematics REQUIRES the use of raw data for any statistical summary.


Yes, that is an issue.

There is no such thing as the "fossil fuel industry". We do not use fossils for fuel. There are many better fuel alternatives, such as coal, oil, natural gas, nuclear, hydro.....


Learn how to form your own arguments, instead of regurgitating what the NY Times says...

Dang! You just earned the stupid post of the day.

 

[evince]

I DO know more about science than the USNAS. I've told you this many times. I'm not going to back down from my claim.

fly that stupid flag


being an uninformed idiot is your strength


Not everyone can have an IQ under 90 like you

 

[cancel2 2022]

The reason you are not invited to discuss science with sentient beings, is because you are arrogant and uninformed enough to claim you know more about science than the prestigious U.S. National Academies of Sciences.

>> https://www.justplainpolitics.com/s...enial-Runs-Red-and-Blue&p=2947253#post2947253

What a nasty sanctimonious hectoring cunt Crypiss is, total fuckwit.

 

[gfm7175]

The leaders of our first nation bands here are supposed to follow the "seven generations" rule. All decisions made are to be weighed with the future in mind -- "How will what we do today affect us seven generations down the road?" We would all do well to adopt that thinking ourselves.

Many people care about the environment.

I was born in a time when no one really cared much about pollution and how it might affect health.

See above.

Fortunately my elders realized that my generation (their children) and those after would suffer if we didn't clean up our nest. So they passed the legislation that created the EPA. As a result I -- and every other American -- has been able to breathe relatively clean air, and drink clean safe water. (Your results may vary in Flint.)

The EPA is unconstitutional and hasn't done a damn thing to clean up the air, environment, etc... They are simply a government agency. It is private businesses, such as Into The Night's business, that actually do these things that you describe. The EPA doesn't do a damn thing to clean up anything. They are government bloat that only gets in the way and slows down the works.

Unless we rid ourselves of 1) anti-education/anti-science morons, and 2) extreme partisanship, those bad old days will be coming back.

1) That would be people such as yourself.
2) That would be people such as yourself.

 

[gfm7175]

I am reasonably confident that the damage Trump is doing to the environment is reversible.

What "damage" has Trump done to the environment? You need to tell us all what this "damage" is...

Once Trump loses the senate

How does Trump lose the Senate? He's not a Senator...

and the White House for the Republican Party,

I think Trump will be just fine.

a Democratic administration has a lot influence simply through executive action, executive orders, and regulation through the executive agencies. Trump's executive orders can be tossed out the window. The good news is that Clean Water Act, Clean Air Act, Endangered Species Act are so popular with Americans, that even legal challenges purporting to undermine their legal authority are destined to be doomed. The danger is when Republicans try to weaken these laws, but to some extent that can be mitigated by having the Executive agencies under the control of sentient human beings, aka Democrats.

Yes, Dems want to implement a Socialist Oligarchy. They want to replace the USA with the SOA (Socialist Oligarchy of America).

 

[gfm7175]

I maintain that the reasonably well educated Trump boot-lickers are fully aware at a visceral level that emitting billions of tons of heat trapping greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, year after year, decade after decade, is a really bad idea and certainly not sustainable.

** It is not possible to trap heat.
** There is no such thing as a "greenhouse gas".

The problem is, they are weak people with fragile egos who spent two decades getting themselves emotionally invested in climate denial; they simply cannot admit to obscure message board posters they have never met, that they were wrong.

People are not denying climate. They simply don't believe in your religion.

The Denial Cabal also has an average age of about eighty four, so being self-centered and self-absorbed conservatives, they do not really give that much of a rat's ass about what will happen to American generations 50 years from now.

** Made up number.
** Bigotry.

Why should elderly Deniers, bound soon for the grave, spend their money to help people half a century from now?

Bigotry. You can't help people who do not yet exist.

As for the profit motive, addressing climate denial in any realistic sense means asking our Corporate Overlords to leave trillions of barrels of undeveloped petroleum in the ground, and never burn it. That is asking these oligarchs to simply walk away from trillions of dollars in profit. I really can't think of any time in human history were environmental sustainability took precedence over trillions of bucks in profit. But I am ever hopeful this might be the one case it actually transpires, because climate change has the reasonable potential to be an existential threat to the earth's ecology, agriculture, and the global economy.

There is no such thing as a "corporate oligarch". Define "climate change". Buzzword Fallacy. Pascal's Wager Fallacy.