How so?
APP - What are your thoughts about a president renaming things after America, because he is in a fight with another country?
- Thread starter Jarod
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ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
You don’t have to hate Trump. Though I suppose some do.
I don’t hate Trump. I disdain, and passionately so, the crime he’s committing. Why would any former law enforcer not disdain it?
I greatly dislike the harm he is doing and the dismantling of or Constitution he;s doing. Why wouldn’t any U.S. Constitution loving person not?
I am offended by the contempt he shows for our laws. Why wouldn’t any law abiding citizen not be?
Mostly I am troubled and amazed at just how unethical Trump is in all of the above. Why wouldn’t an ethical person not be?
All of this suggests a serious, logic based, argument that many MAGA supporters must be; crime supporting, Constitution hating, unethical folks who enjoy being betrayed while being held in utter contempt.
As a philosopher, I’m convinced that Trump isn’t lying − he’s doing something worse
Donald Trump’s false claims about the Iran War, Epstein files, tariffs and inflation have left some supporters who have traditionally believed all he says feeling duped and abandoned. Why now?
theconversation.com
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Check w @Damocles maybe he will move it for you. If it upsets you, you have the power to get it moved, just go off topic. Damocles gives you the power.
The "crime" of denying the democrat Jihad absolute power?
Dismantling the Constitution? Cite?
I saw that in 2021 with the Biden Police State, but nothing from Trump
I know right? The way he ran that massive fraud ring in Minnesota.
Oh wait, that IS Omar, Walz, and Ellison.
Then you must mean the massive Hospice Care fraud in California? Ooops, that Gavin Newsom, Rob Bonta, and Xavier Becerra.
Do ethical people lie and slander their political opponents?
All of this suggests a serious, logic based, argument that many MAGA supporters must be; crime supporting, Constitution hating, unethical folks who enjoy being betrayed while being held in utter contempt.
As a philosopher, I’m convinced that Trump isn’t lying − he’s doing something worse
Donald Trump’s false claims about the Iran War, Epstein files, tariffs and inflation have left some supporters who have traditionally believed all he says feeling duped and abandoned. Why now?
Oh, you're cribbing a Communist hate site - no surprise.
Whine more, read the thread I moved and tell me why I moved it. Don't lie, let's see if you can be honest with yourself.
I’ve read it and told you my thoughts, remember. If a Trumpper doesn’t like a thread, derail it and get it moved.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
Back that up. Make a case. Right now it’s just a claim. Nothing behind it.
Ok, I’ll show you how:
Trump usurps Congressional authority of Congress. Article One clearly indicates Congress, not the President levies tariffs. It clearly states Congress declares war. It declares Congress makes and keeps the budget, though Trump has defunded agencies Congress has funded and spent monies Congress did not approve.
Mazars and Vance, and President Trump’s Ongoing Assault on our Structural Constitution | ACS
Steven D. Schwinn* It’s no secret that President Donald J. Trump has waged a brazen and relentless assault on our constitutional structures of government. Indeed, he may be the first to say so. From his open attacks on the “deep state” to his public disparagement of sitting federal judges to his...
www.acslaw.org
Tracking the Trump Administration’s Harmful Executive Actions
The Trump Administration has acted illegally and unconstitutionally in ways that weaken our democratic institutions, slow down our economy, roll back protections for public health and the environment, and put health care and Social Security benefits at risk for millions of Americans. And that’s...
cohen.house.gov
Can President Trump Do That?
President Donald Trump’s second term has been characterized by relentlessly testing (and often overriding) the legal and constitutional limits of presidential authority. Many of these actions have
The President and Constitutional Violations: Will the Federal Courts Contain the President’s Power Grabs?
It is up to the U.S. Supreme Court to do its duty to uphold constitutional checks and balances on President Donald Trump’s efforts to expand his powers beyond what the U.S. Constitution allows.
www.americanprogress.org
Is the growth of executive power a threat to constitutional democracy? | Brookings
President Trump’s actions through the first five months of his second term have tested the limits of executive power.
www.brookings.edu
Not Democrats, but think tanks and legal organizations who deal in Constitutional law all explaining how Trump had assumed power he doesn’t Constitutionally have.
R
You saw. Make a case already.
Back that up.
A question is not a claim, it is a question.
You alleged a "crime," is it the crime of denying the democrat Jihad absolute power? I mean that does seem to be the central theme of your party.
Ok, I’ll show you how:
Trump usurps Congressional authority of Congress. Article One clearly indicates Congress, not the President levies tariffs. It clearly states Congress declares war. It declares Congress makes and keeps the budget, though Trump has defunded agencies Congress has funded and spent monies Congress did not approve.
Mazars and Vance, and President Trump’s Ongoing Assault on our Structural Constitution | ACS
Steven D. Schwinn* It’s no secret that President Donald J. Trump has waged a brazen and relentless assault on our constitutional structures of government. Indeed, he may be the first to say so. From his open attacks on the “deep state” to his public disparagement of sitting federal judges to his...
Tracking the Trump Administration’s Harmful Executive Actions
The Trump Administration has acted illegally and unconstitutionally in ways that weaken our democratic institutions, slow down our economy, roll back protections for public health and the environment, and put health care and Social Security benefits at risk for millions of Americans. And that’s...
Can President Trump Do That?
President Donald Trump’s second term has been characterized by relentlessly testing (and often overriding) the legal and constitutional limits of presidential authority. Many of these actions havecampaignlegal.org
The President and Constitutional Violations: Will the Federal Courts Contain the President’s Power Grabs?
It is up to the U.S. Supreme Court to do its duty to uphold constitutional checks and balances on President Donald Trump’s efforts to expand his powers beyond what the U.S. Constitution allows.
Is the growth of executive power a threat to constitutional democracy? | Brookings
President Trump’s actions through the first five months of his second term have tested the limits of executive power.
ROFL
This is a classic Straw Man fallacy.
You post an argument I did not make and attack it because you think it will be easy to defeat, then declare victory over me. Fallacy is as close as the left generally gets to logic.
I said nothing of tariffs.
And if you are claiming that Trump committed a "crime" by imposing tariffs on China, think again.
JFK brought about the Trade Expansion Act of 1962, which is the legal basis Trump acted under.
This allows the president to act without express congressional approval.
LBJ used this to impose a 25 percent tariff on light trucks, potato starch, dextrin, and brandy against the European Commonwealth without congress. No one complained.
Nixon used it in 1973 when he imposed a universal 10% tariff on ALL imports from ALL sources without congress to fight inflation. (That his moronic price freezes had caused.)
Ford imposed a 60% tariff on oil - again without congress.
Jimmy Carter vastly expanded the Kennedy TEA with the International Emergency Economic Powers Act or 1977.
Reagan put a 100% tariff of Japanese electronics in 1987 - without congress - to punish them for violating trade agreements.
Reagan Imposes 100% Tariffs on Japan Goods : Retaliatory Sanctions Aimed at $300 Million in Electronic Products in Semiconductor Dispute
President Reagan decided Friday to impose punitive 100% tariffs on a wide variety of goods produced by Japanese electronic giants in retaliation for Tokyo's failure to abide by the semiconductor trade agreement between the two nations.
www.latimes.com
Dubya imposed a 100% tariff on 7 middle eastern nations directly after 9-11, on presidential order.
Then there is Obama - "I have a pen and a phone" who stated; “The answer is to do trade the right way, by negotiating with other countries so that they raise their labor standards and their environmental standards; and we make sure they don’t impose unfair tariffs on American goods or steal American intellectual property. That’s how we make sure that international rules are consistent with our values — including human rights. And ultimately, that’s how we help raise wages here in America. That’s how we help our workers compete on a level playing field.” - openly defying the Republican congress who attempted to contain him.
BUT that was (D)ifferent - this is TRUMP, and you HATE TRUMP, he is Emmanuel Goldstein, the cause of every bad thing that has ever happened, or ever will happen. When HE imposed tariff they were CRIMINAL because HATE TWUMP and he should be thrown in prison or executed. It's not like when other presidents did the identical things, because the party doesn't accept that TWUMP is really president, and HATE TWUMP.
Right, like the middle of the road guys at Brookings...
Again, this is a straw man, a logical fallacy.
You are arguing against a point I hadn't made.
I took apart your partisan talking points anyway - but that doesn't alter that you engaged in fallacy.
What in the world are you talking about?
We ALL saw the police state in 2021.
This was only 5 years ago.
The heart of the Biden police state was;
Executive Order 14074 - Wikipedia
This was the heart of Obama's Biden Junta in general.
When Torquemada launched the inquisition in the 15th century, it wasn't because their was actually danger from the devil and witches; it was a naked grab for power.
Likewise Obama's puppet wasn't "fighting covid," but simply creating a totalitarian state ruled by your party.
He never let up.
It’s ‘1984’ all over again in Biden’s ‘Police State’
The “Police State” being created by this president, or those pulling his strings, is the title of a chilling new documentary by conservative filmmaker Dinesh D’Souza, which opens next week in New Y…
nypost.com
Look, you're WAYYYY left of center and no doubt applauded all of this, but for those who support the Constitution and the Bill of Right, this was a treasonous attempt to end our Republic.
It is a valid topic. Lets discuss.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
Article One is pretty clear on the separation of powers between the branches.A question is not a claim, it is a question.
You alleged a "crime," is it the crime of denying the democrat Jihad absolute power? I mean that does seem to be the central theme of your party.
ROFL
This is a classic Straw Man fallacy.
You post an argument I did not make and attack it because you think it will be easy to defeat, then declare victory over me. Fallacy is as close as the left generally gets to logic.
I said nothing of tariffs.
And if you are claiming that Trump committed a "crime" by imposing tariffs on China, think again.
JFK brought about the Trade Expansion Act of 1962, which is the legal basis Trump acted under.
This allows the president to act without express congressional approval.
LBJ used this to impose a 25 percent tariff on light trucks, potato starch, dextrin, and brandy against the European Commonwealth without congress. No one complained.
Nixon used it in 1973 when he imposed a universal 10% tariff on ALL imports from ALL sources without congress to fight inflation. (That his moronic price freezes had caused.)
Ford imposed a 60% tariff on oil - again without congress.
Jimmy Carter vastly expanded the Kennedy TEA with the International Emergency Economic Powers Act or 1977.
Reagan put a 100% tariff of Japanese electronics in 1987 - without congress - to punish them for violating trade agreements.
Reagan Imposes 100% Tariffs on Japan Goods : Retaliatory Sanctions Aimed at $300 Million in Electronic Products in Semiconductor Dispute
President Reagan decided Friday to impose punitive 100% tariffs on a wide variety of goods produced by Japanese electronic giants in retaliation for Tokyo's failure to abide by the semiconductor trade agreement between the two nations.
Dubya imposed a 100% tariff on 7 middle eastern nations directly after 9-11, on presidential order.
Then there is Obama - "I have a pen and a phone" who stated; “The answer is to do trade the right way, by negotiating with other countries so that they raise their labor standards and their environmental standards; and we make sure they don’t impose unfair tariffs on American goods or steal American intellectual property. That’s how we make sure that international rules are consistent with our values — including human rights. And ultimately, that’s how we help raise wages here in America. That’s how we help our workers compete on a level playing field.” - openly defying the Republican congress who attempted to contain him.
BUT that was (D)ifferent - this is TRUMP, and you HATE TRUMP, he is Emmanuel Goldstein, the cause of every bad thing that has ever happened, or ever will happen. When HE imposed tariff they were CRIMINAL because HATE TWUMP and he should be thrown in prison or executed. It's not like when other presidents did the identical things, because the party doesn't accept that TWUMP is really president, and HATE TWUMP.
Right, like the middle of the road guys at Brookings...
Again, this is a straw man, a logical fallacy.
You are arguing against a point I hadn't made.
I took apart your partisan talking points anyway - but that doesn't alter that you engaged in fallacy.
What in the world are you talking about?
We ALL saw the police state in 2021.
This was only 5 years ago.
The heart of the Biden police state was;
Executive Order 14074 - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
This was the heart of Obama's Biden Junta in general.
When Torquemada launched the inquisition in the 15th century, it wasn't because their was actually danger from the devil and witches; it was a naked grab for power.
Likewise Obama's puppet wasn't "fighting covid," but simply creating a totalitarian state ruled by your party.
He never let up.
It’s ‘1984’ all over again in Biden’s ‘Police State’
The “Police State” being created by this president, or those pulling his strings, is the title of a chilling new documentary by conservative filmmaker Dinesh D’Souza, which opens next week in New Y…
Look, you're WAYYYY left of center and no doubt applauded all of this, but for those who support the Constitution and the Bill of Right, this was a treasonous attempt to end our Republic.
The Emoluments Clause needs to be much cheater. Still, other Presidents didn’t have a problem stating in the lines.
Trump is a bad person. A more than 60 year span of bad, unethical, acts well documented by books, court cases, depositions, etc. and so forth.
MAGA is the canary in the coal mine if cultural decay. Signaling our society is in decline.
It is precisely that I am a Conservative, flag waving, democracy loving, traditional values kind of guy that I know that.
No REAL conservative would abide a man of Trump’s abysmal ethics and horrible character in the White House
As bad as any Reg. Org. Poli-hack of either party might be Trump is so much worse. That MAGA fails to discern that is a them problem. One they truly need to fix before they drive this bus we’re all in off a cliff.
I agree, no true conservative would support Trump, in fact the true conservatives left the media almost completely. Only an authoritarian would rename things unilaterally, in the name of nationalism. I do not agree with going around renaming things out of political spite or nationalism.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
Renaming things, ball rooms, Arc de Triumphs, reflecting pools. This is all trifling nonsense. It’s dumb, it’s gaudy, it’s in bad taste but it’s not the big problem. Which is we were already heading in a bad direction, repeating behaviors of 100 years ago that lead to 20 years I’d the worst global economic collapse we’ve had in modern times.
We are going to have another one fairly soon if we don’t smarten up and Trump has done nothing but accelerate our impacting that solid wall.
I agree, I’m concerned, but I don’t think our industry leaders want that (maybe they do) and they get what they want.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
The wealthiest of us had some concerning times. Things were getting ugly as noises of, “Eat the rich.”, were heard. They didn’t get eaten though, and they purchased much for dimes on dollars in the fire sale that was The Great Depression. Plus the arrogant smugness of their stupid, “We are the wealthiest so we must also be the smartest people in the room.’, runs very deep.
Personally, I believe that the AI companies are backing off, or pretending to, because they want to write their own regulations.
Actually, Article I outlines, enumerates the powers granted to congress.
You're chanting hate slogans absent any grasp of what they mean.
Your party has hunted Trump for 10 years. If there were any legitimacy to the nonsense you repeat from the hate sites, you'd have long ago imprisoned or executed the object of rage and uncontrollable hatred.
You don't know that it's all bullshit, because the party, the hive, does your thinking for you. But it is bullshit.
Your party filed three lawsuits, all of which were dismissed as having no merit by the courts.
Yes, you hate him. I understand that. Your party manipulates and controls you through strong emotion.
Partisans can claim anything. What your party and the slander troops never do is present facts.
Well, not everyone can be a pure and perfect as the DSA
You are not a conservative. There is absolutely nothing you post that is consistent with any conservative principle.
No true scotsman? Fallacy is as close as any leftist gets to logic.
Would Zohran Mamdani be the model for a "real" conservative? What is the heart of conservatism for you? One party rule? "To each according to his need, from each according to his ability?" Government control of the means of production?
Yes, you passionately and desperately HATE TWUMP, we get it. Virtually all leftists do.
Trump denied your party the absolute power it lusts for, Hillary was anointed - the usurper "stole" her rightful place. That's why Obama HAD to stage an attempted coup in 2017. You don't view that as treason because you didn't view Trump as the legitimate president - Hillary was meant to rule and bring about uncontested dominance by your party from that point on.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
Right. The ones Trump keeps usurping. The power to tax. The power to declare war.
You like to tell others what they are all about. This is APP. That’s not the way here. Make you case. I’ll make mine.
Mine is much less work. Trump leaves a vast paper trail behind him. It is strewn with victims. It’s just use to be money and grief, but since MAGA gave him power its bodies now. Floating in the Caribbean Sea, on the streets of Minneapolis and elsewhere.
I don’t hate Trump, though I’M not fond of criminality. I am neither fond of unthinking, non-discerning acts that bring more chaos and pain into the world than already exist. MAGA is a chaos fairy, sprinkling the results of their lack of vision into a setting already too devoid of sound ethical thinking and common sense.
Their nonfeasance has escalated into malfeasance and allows Trump the impunity to steal and kill without due process from behind the Resolute Desk.
I do not hate Trump, but I’d arrest him if I could. I don’t hate MAGA, but I’d make them take and pass both civics and ethics courses before I’d let them vote again.
TWUMP is usurping...
LOL
Trump has imposed no taxes. I understand that you hate him, but that doesn't excuse lying to smear him.
Just a little history;
Bill Clinton went to war against Serbia on behalf of Al Qaeda without congressional approval.
Lord GOD and Emperor of the Universe. his holy highness Obama (according to democrats) went to war in 4 countries to implement his Al Qaeda Spring - no congressional approval sought.
Besides, repeating what is on Young Turks and CCP-Now is easier than legitimate research.
LOL
Unless it Tim Walz, Omar, and Minnesota fraudsters.
Partisan tripe.
Partisan nonsense based on rage and hatred rather than facts.
Demonstrably false.
On what charge? Usurping power from the party?
Perhaps start with your own party - or even yourself.
ModernDiogenes
Well-known member
Clinton stayed within the War Powers Act. Trump has not. Obama stayed within the War Powers Act. Trump has not.
Trump has violated multiple Constitutional parameters. Chiefly but not limited to usurping Congressional authority, the Emoluments Clause and the taking of bribes that influence Presidential actions, such as giving pardons.
You are flailing. Trump belongs in prison and if I had my way he'd wind up exactly like Gotti [who Trump admired] or Madoff [a closer resemblence to Trump].