Archaeology of the New Testament

[Cypress]

We don't know where the universe came from and that's ok.

You're contradicting yourself.

On the one hand, you say 'we don't know'.

On the other hand, you are 100 percent certain there can't be higher any rational agency behind the origin of a mathematically rational and lawfully organized universe.

You don't get to make both those contradicting claims at the same time.

If you really believe nothing exists but inanimate matter and energy, then you are stuck having to explain the miracle of how lawfully organized matter and energy just appeared out of nothing

 

[ZenMode]

You're contradicting yourself.

On the one hand, you say 'we don't know'.

On the other hand, you are 100 percent certain there can't be higher any rational agency behind the origin of a mathematically rational and lawfully organized universe.

You don't get to make both those contradicting claims at the same time.

If you really believe nothing exists but inanimate matter and energy, then you are stuck having to explain the miracle of how lawfully organized matter and energy just appeared out of nothing

There's no contradiction. It's true that we don't know where the universe came from. It's also true that there is insufficient evidence to believe it was blinked into existence by any of the magical beings that man has claimed exist. You are using the same logic that ancient man used to explain the sun, stars, disease, etc before we understood the actual source of those things.

You are an atheist as it relates to all the same gods that I am... except for one.

 

[Cypress]

Yes. Rather than converting a cracker into flesh, they just give you a cracker and tell you it's the body of christ.

It's symbolic
In the Protestant tradition, Christ is present spiritually in the communion, but he doesn't turn into a cracker.

If you were asked to explain the essence of Christian belief to someone from Papua New Guinea, you wouldn't say it's basically about crackers.

So you even know yourself that crackers aren't really the essence of the Protestant Christian life, anymore than the wedding toast defines the essence of a marriage.

 

[Cypress]

There's no contradiction. It's true that we don't know where the universe came from. It's also true that there is insufficient evidence to believe it was blinked into existence by any of the magical beings that man has claimed exist. You are using the same logic that ancient man used to explain the sun, stars, disease, etc before we understood the actual source of those things.

You are an atheist as it relates to all the same gods that I am... except for one.

It's a complete contradiction to claim "we don't know" but then also claim you are 100 percent certain there is no rational agency underlying the sudden appearance of lawfully organized matter and energy.

Modern cosmology has convincingly shown there was an origin point, and that the unexpected net zero energy balance of the universe implies it came from nothing. So if you really are a strict physical materialist, you are stuck explaining how something could come from nothing.

 

[ZenMode]

It's a complete contradiction to claim "we don't know" but then also claim you are 100 percent certain there is no rational agency underlying the sudden appearance of lawfully organized matter and energy.

I've never claimed 100% certainty on the existence of any gods.

Modern cosmology has convincingly shown there was an origin point, and that the unexpected net zero energy balance of the universe implies it came from nothing. So if you really are a strict physical materialist, you are stuck explaining how something could come from nothing.

Again...imaginary beings have been used to explain the "unexplainable" for nearly as long as man has existed. Other than it being what you want and have been conditioned to believe, why do you believe the existence of the universe will be any different? There's no more evidence for the Christian god than there is any of the other gods that man has believed in.

You only believe in the Christian god by chance, anyway. Had you been born in a different time, part of the world or to a different family, you could be on here preaching the legitimacy of Zeus as the creator of the universe.

 

[Ichabod Stain]

It's a complete contradiction to claim "we don't know" but then also claim you are 100 percent certain there is no rational agency underlying the sudden appearance of lawfully organized matter and energy.

Modern cosmology has convincingly shown there was an origin point, and that the unexpected net zero energy balance of the universe implies it came from nothing. So if you really are a strict physical materialist, you are stuck explaining how something could come from nothing.

big bang is just a theory.

probably wrong.

 

[Into the Night]

Care to try again and attempt to answer the questions?

RQAA

 

[Into the Night]

Atheists believe in the biggest miracle of all. That a mathematically rational, lawfully organized, finely tuned universe popped into existence out of nothing by pure chance.

Who says it popped into existence at all?

Protestants specifically rejected the doctrine of transmutation.

Buzzword fallacy.

Christianity as a whole does not boil down in essence to crackers. You are just selectivity complaining about the parts you don't like.

This part is true.

Ritual practice and belief is a big part of all of our lives. Everytime you perform a toast at a wedding or blow out birthday candles you are participating in a ritual belief.

This part is also true.

So we are in agreement that all Christians are not required to believe everything in the Bible is literally true.

Discarding the Bible again?

Frankly, I can't see how anyone could treat the entire Bible as literal historical biography and scientific reporting.

Science is not religion.
Science is not the Bible.
You simply can't see, apparently.
The Bible is more than history.

That what makes you unexpectedly extremely similar to fundamentalist Pentecostals and Southern Baptists.

 

[Into the Night]

Correct. None of the thousands of gods, that man has claimed exist, has ever convinced me they exist. That being the case, if I haven't been convinced in the existence of any gods, there's no reason to believe in their powers.

So you belong to the Church of No God, a fundamentalist style religion.

It is not possible to prove whether any god or gods exist or not.

 

[Into the Night]

ftfy
Webster's dictionary and Cambridge dictionary disagree with your claim that biochemistry is not a word.

So? Biochemistry is not a word.

 

[ZenMode]

RQAA

Yep... the troll games start when you can't answer questions or support you nonsensical claims.

It would be less embarrassing to just not respond.

When you want to provide anything to support your claim that biochemistry isn't a word, I'll be here. Until then, I'm out.

 

[ZenMode]

So you belong to the Church of No God, a fundamentalist style religion.

It is not possible to prove whether any god or gods exist or not.

I belong to the world of evidence and belief.

Religious people, like you and @Cypress , belong to the world of faith, which means believing despite a lack of evidence.

 

[Into the Night]

We don't know where the universe came from and that's ok.

Does it have a return label on it?

The fact is, many of the gaps in our knowledge were once filled by gods: lightning, disease, stars, mental illness, etc. Saying "I don't know" is infinitely more honest than manufacturing magical beings.

So you belong to the Church of No God, a fundamentalist style religion.

Yes. Rather than converting a cracker into flesh, they just give you a cracker and tell you it's the body of christ.

Word games. They won't help you.
Bread or crackers have been used to symbolize the body of Christ, who was slain and resurrected to save the world.

I promise, it has nothing to do with "like".

Lie. Denial.

Yes, but they aren't generally based on consuming the blood and flesh of magical beings.

Who is 'they'?

No, there is no "Final Boss" that makes Christians believe anything. The range is wide. There are pastors in AZ who are still preaching that all gays should be killed. At the opposite end of the spectrum is someone like James Talarico who finds support for transgenderism in the Bible.

Random words and wanderings ignored.

It would have been great if the all-knowing, all-powerful creator of the universe had been clearer on many topics...

Why do you think the Universe was created?

Conversely, many people can't understand how one can't recognize the Bible as the perfect, inerrant word of God.

I already know you discard the Bible.

Of course, as time goes on, and we advance as a society,

So your religion is an 'advancement' over any other religion?

the number of Biblical literalists will decrease or the rationalization will increase.

Buzzsword fallacies (literalists, rationalization).
Rationalization is not a quantity. You are attempting to rationalize your religion. Circular argument fallacy (fundamentalism).

 

[Into the Night]

I've never claimed 100% certainty on the existence of any gods.

DON'T TRY TO DENY YOUR OWN POSTS!

 

[Into the Night]

big bang is just a theory.

probably wrong.

The Theory of the Big Bang is a nonscientific theory. It is also a religion.
It also presumes a paradox:

If the event causing the Big Bang existed before the Universe, where does it exist?

2nd question: how big is the Universe? There is no known boundary.

 

[Into the Night]

Yep... the troll games start when you can't answer questions or support you nonsensical claims.

RQAA

It would be less embarrassing to just not respond.

RQAA

When you want to provide anything to support your claim that biochemistry isn't a word, I'll be here. Until then, I'm out.

RQAA

You don't need to be a troll, you know.

 

[Into the Night]

I belong to the world of evidence and belief.

So does everyone with a religion. You are no different.

Religious people, like you and @Cypress , belong to the world of faith, which means believing despite a lack of evidence.

There is evidence. You can't make it just disappear. I have already listed quite a bit of it.

 

[Into the Night]

You're contradicting yourself.

Not on this point. He really doesn't know. Neither do you. No one knows if the Universe was created at all! Perhaps it has always been here, and always will. It has no beginning, and it has no end.

On the one hand, you say 'we don't know'.

On the other hand, you are 100 percent certain there can't be higher any rational agency behind the origin of a mathematically rational and lawfully organized universe.

The Universe isn't organized. No math, other than random number mathematics. The Universe is a perfect randR generator.

You don't get to make both those contradicting claims at the same time.

They are YOUR contradicting claims, Cyborg. Inversiion fallacy. You don't know the Universe any better than he does.

If you really believe nothing exists but inanimate matter and energy, then you are stuck having to explain the miracle of how lawfully organized matter and energy just appeared out of nothing

The Universe is not organized. There is no 'law'. There is no equation of the Universe.

 

[Into the Night]

I've never claimed 100% certainty on the existence of any gods.

Again...imaginary beings have been used to explain the "unexplainable" for nearly as long as man has existed. Other than it being what you want and have been conditioned to believe, why do you believe the existence of the universe will be any different? There's no more evidence for the Christian god than there is any of the other gods that man has believed in.

You only believe in the Christian god by chance, anyway. Had you been born in a different time, part of the world or to a different family, you could be on here preaching the legitimacy of Zeus as the creator of the universe.

You can't make any evidence just disappear. Every religion has supporting evidence, even yours.

 

[Ichabod Stain]

It's a complete contradiction to claim "we don't know" but then also claim you are 100 percent certain there is no rational agency underlying the sudden appearance of lawfully organized matter and energy.

Modern cosmology has convincingly shown there was an origin point, and that the unexpected net zero energy balance of the universe implies it came from nothing. So if you really are a strict physical materialist, you are stuck explaining how something could come from nothing.

YOU said 100% certain.

he didn't say that.

you do this all the time.

yer dum