America Retreating from Religion

Iolo/Penderyn said:
All 'religions' contain two elements - what we might call Godswallop, nonsense about the Universe that will justify pretty well anything, and advice about how to behave. In America there is a huge stress on the Godswallop, and a pretty total desertion of right behaviour. No-one who had actually read and followed the New Testament could conceivably have supported Trump.
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Agree. Religion in America is a negative force.
 
Cypress said:
If you want to highlight crimes by the Catholic Church, the Spanish Inquisition is not your strongest case. Despite its fearsome reputation in popular culture, by the standards of historical genocides, the Spanish Inquisition was pretty tame - only a few thousand people were actually executed.

If one wants to make Catholics look bad, I suggest the Jewish pogroms of the First Crusade. Entire Jewish communities in Germany were razed to the ground, and perhaps tens of thousands of Jews were murdered.

To be fair, the leaders of the Catholic Church condemned the pograms, but since Christian laypersons purporting to be on crusade committed the crimes, Christianity should own it.

On the flipside, once you open up those floodgates, the historical record of state sponsored atheism comes under scrutiny as well. The USSR proudly sponsored state atheism, and in the name of atheism mudered and persecuted millions of Orthodox, Catholic, and Baptist Christians and Muslim minorities.
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The papists are estimated to be fairly central in the death of 12 million native Americans in just what is now the US. About 55 million are estimated to have died in the Americas from 1492 to 1600 or 95% of the entire population in just 100 years. Obviously papist played a central role.
 
Cypress said:
If you want to highlight crimes by the Catholic Church, the Spanish Inquisition is not your strongest case. Despite its fearsome reputation in popular culture, by the standards of historical genocides, the Spanish Inquisition was pretty tame - only a few thousand people were actually executed.

If one wants to make Catholics look bad, I suggest the Jewish pogroms of the First Crusade. Entire Jewish communities in Germany were razed to the ground, and perhaps tens of thousands of Jews were murdered.

To be fair, the leaders of the Catholic Church condemned the pograms, but since Christian laypersons purporting to be on crusade committed the crimes, Christianity should own it.

On the flipside, once you open up those floodgates, the historical record of state sponsored atheism comes under scrutiny as well. The USSR proudly sponsored state atheism, and in the name of atheism mudered and persecuted millions of Orthodox, Catholic, and Baptist Christians and Muslim minorities.
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katzgar said:
The papists are estimated to be fairly central in the death of 12 million native Americans in just what is now the US. About 55 million are estimated to have died in the Americas from 1492 to 1600 or 95% of the entire population in just 100 years. Obviously papist played a central role.
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I actually blame capitalism and imperialism for the rape of the New World, though the Spanish Catholic Church was a collaborator.

Important to note however: most of those millions of indigenous deaths were due to small pox and other microbes introduced inadvertently from the Old World, and was not the consequence of an intentional genocide.

There was more than enough cruelty towards the indigenous people without having to resort to laying the 20 million deaths due to small pox at the feet of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church played a huge role in the destruction and oppression of the cultural heritage of the native peoples. The historical record demonstrates the Church's cruel and zealous measures to wipe out native religion and customs.

To be fair, it should be noted that of all the Spaniards, some Catholic friars and priests were advocates for the humane treatment of indigenous people. None of the capitalists, plantation owners, mine owners, or conquistadors showed any measurable concern.
 
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PostmodernProphet said:
idiots created atheism.......
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That is backwards. We are born free from religion and the hate for others that it entails. Then kids are trained into religion from a very young age. Almost all religions do that and get to kids before they have the knowledge and maturity to fight the messages.
Atheism includes the ability to think for yourself.
 
Cypress said:
I actually blame capitalism and imperialism for the rape of the New World, though the Spanish Catholic Church was a collaborator.

Important to note however: most of those millions of indigenous deaths were due to small pox and other microbes introduced inadvertently from the Old World, and was not the consequence of an intentional genocide.

There was more than enough cruelty towards the indigenous people without having to resort to laying the 20 million deaths due to small pox at the feet of the Catholic church.

The Catholic church played a huge role in the destruction and oppression of the cultural heritage of the native peoples. The historical record demonstrates the Church's cruel and zealous measures to wipe out native religion and customs.

To be fair, it should be noted that of all the Spaniards, some Catholic friars and priests were advocates for the humane treatment of indigenous people. None of the capitalists, plantation owners, mine owners, or conquistadors showed any measurable concern.
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If you read what I said I said fairly Central
 
Jack said:
"Since 1990, the fraction of Americans with no religious affiliation has nearly tripled, from about 8 percent to 22 percent. Over the next 20 years, this trend will accelerate: by 2020, there will be more of these "Nones" than Catholics, and by 2035, they will outnumber Protestants."

This is why the Christian Nationalists feel they must take over the Government. They know they are losing Membership.
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That is the purpose of the establishment clause.
 
Nordberg said:
That is backwards. We are born free from religion and the hate for others that it entails. Then kids are trained into religion from a very young age. Almost all religions do that and get to kids before they have the knowledge and maturity to fight the messages.
Atheism includes the ability to think for yourself.
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"Atheism" is what religious fundamentalists call anyone not buying into their belief system.
 
Cypress said:
If you want to highlight crimes by the Catholic Church, the Spanish Inquisition is not your strongest case. Despite its fearsome reputation in popular culture, by the standards of historical genocides, the Spanish Inquisition was pretty tame - only a few thousand people were actually executed.

If one wants to make Catholics look bad, I suggest the Jewish pogroms of the First Crusade. Entire Jewish communities in Germany were razed to the ground, and perhaps tens of thousands of Jews were murdered.

To be fair, the leaders of the Catholic Church condemned the pograms, but since Christian laypersons purporting to be on crusade committed the crimes, Christianity should own it.

On the flipside, once you open up those floodgates, the historical record of state sponsored atheism comes under scrutiny as well. The USSR proudly sponsored state atheism, and in the name of atheism mudered and persecuted millions of Orthodox, Catholic, and Baptist Christians and Muslim minorities.
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I bring up the Spanish Inquisition as a point of the viciousness, the pure diabolical evilness of a group that professes "Jesus is Love".

30 Years War. I'm good with this as Good Christians killing each other in the Name of God.

"The Thirty Years’ War was a 17th-century religious conflict fought primarily in central Europe. It remains one of the longest and most brutal wars in human history, with more than 8 million casualties resulting from military battles as well as from the famine and disease caused by the conflict. The war lasted from 1618 to 1648, starting as a battle among the Catholic and Protestant states that formed the Holy Roman Empire. However, as the Thirty Years’ War evolved, it became less about religion and more about which group would ultimately govern Europe. In the end, the conflict changed the geopolitical face of Europe and the role of religion and nation-states in society."
https://www.history.com/topics/reformation/thirty-years-war
 
katzgar said:
If you read what I said I said fairly Central
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indeed

I have been trying to limit myself to crimes which are directly attributable to Catholicism or State Atheism. To cases where there is a clear cause-and-effect.

Catholicism was only tangential to the economic forces which led to the discovery and subjugation of the New World.

Similarly one could attempt to blame Soviet State Atheism and it's hostility towards fundamentalist Islam for the invasion and atrocities in Afghanistan. But the truth is atheism was not the driving force.
 
katzgar said:
Nobody created atheism you more on
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lol.....you're just like her.....

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Cypress said:
indeed

I have been trying to limit myself to crimes which are directly attributable to Catholicism or State Atheism. To cases where there is a clear cause-and-effect.

Catholicism was only tangential to the economic forces which led to the discovery and subjugation of the New World.

Similarly one could attempt to blame Soviet State Atheism and it's hostility towards fundamentalist Islam for the invasion and atrocities in Afghanistan. But the truth is atheism was not the driving force.
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Funny how an entire Continent is subservient to the Caliphate in Rome if 'Religion' was so tangential.
 
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