A little education for our Maga/Alt-Right friends.

Amazing how you concoct your own version of reality.
Nope. That would be you. I just use the one that's already here.

To date, you have Not presented any valid, fact based DOCUMENTATION
No documentation is needed. I explained to you the fallacy in the video. If you are so slow that you need me to explain it to you a third time, let me know.

to discreit any of my posts on this thread.
Your posts discredit themselves. Pick any baseless declaration that you have made and I'll be more than happy to explain why it's a load of crap.

Any high school history teacher will tell you that.
There aren't any high school history teachers who will tell me that. Oh, that would be yet another one of your baseless declarations that would discredit you if you actually had any credibility.

The chronology of the posts ...
You like this phrase. You're one of those people who will never use a long word when a diminutive one will do.

Hint: Chronology doesn't show anything. Your previous posts are what reveal everything. You just babble.
 
Brisbane is next to SF. This area is a former industrial site but people in the City, led by the now 91 year old former Mayor, have been fighting tooth and nail against building housing here for decades because they don't want their City to change.

It's the ultimate fvck you I've got mine attitude and a prime example of why housing is so expensive in California. Wonder how much racism is playing a role in this.

​

A suburb bordering S.F. lost control over housing development. What happens next?​


A couple of decades from now, if developers have their way, Caltrain riders leaving Bayshore station will look out over a new carbon-neutral neighborhood of apartment buildings, tree-lined streets and plazas. But as former Brisbane Mayor Ray Miller clutched his cane at that little-used stop on a recent afternoon, he was pleased to see only towering weeds, rusting fences and a grassy mound where one of the Bay Area’s largest garbage dumps once sat.

“What makes me angry,” he said, “is thinking about what this place might become.”

Miller, 91, is hardly alone. For the past 21 years, he and many other Brisbane residents have opposed efforts to transform the roughly 680-acre former industrial site straddling the San Francisco border into a mixed-use development with thousands of homes. They fear the proposed Baylands project, which could more than double the population of their hillside suburb, would threaten Brisbane’s small-town character while posing serious long-term environmental and health risks.

Yet as California’s housing crisis has worsened, state officials have become less willing to accept those concerns as justification for blocking more homes. In July, after Brisbane repeatedly missed deadlines to approve a plan for up to 2,200 homes on the Baylands site that would cover 81% of its state-mandated housing allocation, California ruled the city out of compliance with state housing laws.

That puts Brisbane at risk of civil penalties, a lawsuit or the loss of state funding if it doesn’t adopt the plan. Now, as housing advocates wait to see what Brisbane does next, this community of 4,700 residents just south of San Francisco finds itself at the center of a heated statewide debate: Can California’s increasingly aggressive enforcement of housing laws accomplish what years of planning mandates couldn’t?

“It’s pretty ironic when you think about it,” said Jeremy Levine, policy manager for the Housing Leadership Council of San Mateo County, which has worked to educate Brisbane residents on the Baylands project. “This community was so determined to protect what makes it special that it actually ended up with less control over its future.”

Most California cities are well behind on their state-mandated housing targets. But of the dozen or so that the state has deemed noncompliant, none matters more to the Bay Area housing shortage than Brisbane. The Baylands site, with its sprawling acreage near Highway 101, public transit and major employment centers in San Francisco and Silicon Valley, could make a significant dent in one of the nation’s most severe regional job-housing imbalances.


Pressure has been building in Brisbane, where the median home sale price more than doubled to $1.3 million in 2022 from $597,500 in 2012, according to the city’s housing plan. For young people who grew up here, the prospect of staying — or coming back — can feel out of reach.

“I think I’m going to pursue a career in tech sales, just because I hope to afford a house in my hometown someday,” said Sebastian Bousquet, an 18-year-old Brisbane native now attending the University of San Diego. “I want to have a family, and give my kids a childhood like the one I had, which will probably cost a lot of money.”

Nearly eight years after Brisbane voters approved housing plans for the Baylands site, city leaders have yet to adopt the zoning needed to build them. The city’s Planning Commission voted unanimously last month to recommend the City Council finally adopt the plan. Last Thursday, the council scheduled a final vote in October, setting up a test of whether California can compel local officials to approve housing.

“What’s happening in Brisbane really is a fascinating case study for this new approach the state has taken with its housing laws,” said Christopher Elmendorf, a law professor at UC Davis who’s a leading authority on California housing law. “A lot of eyes will be on those city council meetings.”
Brisbane has long attracted outsize attention on housing-related issues. For decades, developers have eyed the Baylands’ vast expanse of dry grass, weeds, dirt and gravel for its real estate potential.

The official Baylands development website reads like an urbanist fever dream for sustainable living: A massive solar farm. An on-site fleet of electric cars for residents. Zero carbon footprint. But to many current Brisbane residents, those renderings of futuristic streetscapes might feel borderline delusional.

The Baylands site was once where San Francisco dumped its garbage and Southern Pacific railroad repaired its trains. Cleaning up the lingering contamination will likely require at least hundreds of millions of dollars and three years of soil work.

“The whole thing is just ridiculous,” said Miller, a retired San Francisco State professor with a white beard. “They used to burn tires over there. You don’t mess with that.”

Miller and his wife, Anja, bought their yellow two-story house in Brisbane for $25,000 in 1967, the same year the landfill closed. They grew to love their small town, which owes its “City of Stars” nickname to an annual holiday ritual in which locals hang huge illuminated stars on their homes. At a downtown park, fire hydrants are painted in bright colors, then later retired to the town’s tiny hydrant graveyard.

The couple entered local politics, each serving on city council and as mayor. Miller was on the City Council in 1980 when, after years of fighting a massive development project on San Bruno Mountain, the city helped convince the federal government to declare the mountain critical habitat for the endangered callippe silverspot butterfly. Nine years later, as mayor, he helped negotiate a settlement with a developer — who sued him personally — to scale back another proposed development on the mountain.

But nothing could prepare Brisbane for the battle over the Baylands.

The saga began in 2004, when development group Universal Paragon Corp. applied to build 1 million square feet of commercial and retail space on the old landfill. The proposal called for shopping centers, offices, auto dealerships and hotels — but not housing, which the developer said was incompatible with the site’s contamination.

The plan evolved over the years as environmental studies and cleanup proposals developed, and demand for housing grew. By 2010, the proposal called for about 4,400 homes, mostly concentrated in the northwest corner of the Baylands site, away from the old landfill.

As neighbors aired their opposition to the project, housing activists cast Brisbane as a poster child for the NIMBY movement. Early in the city’s negotiations with Baylands developers, for example, a City Council member had even suggested skirting a state law that requires cities to plan for new housing — by zoning for homes at the bottom of the Brisbane lagoon.

In 2016, the City Council was still pushing for a Baylands plan devoted entirely to retail when a quote from Mayor Cliff Lentz published in the Chronicle went viral: “We’ll provide the commercial — S.F. will provide the housing.” To pro-housing activists, the quip captured their mounting frustration with the limits of local control over sprawling housing projects.

Proposition 13 — the 1978 California law that caps property-tax rates and limits increases in assessed property value — created a powerful incentive for cities to favor commercial development over housing. And that’s not even accounting for what author Jennifer Mapes, who has written extensively about small-town development, calls the “charm factor.”

Brisbane residents take immense pride in their 3-square-mile community’s slightly eclectic, self-contained civic culture. “In a place like that, tradition really matters,” Mapes said. “When faced with the prospect of such expansive growth, it’s almost natural for people to kind of freak out.”

In late 2017, desperate to push the project forward after more than a decade with minimal progress, the California legislature threatened to strip Brisbane of its control over the Baylands if it didn’t approve thousands of homes. Left with little choice, the City Council introduced a ballot measure that offered a compromise: 2,200 housing units.

It narrowly passed in November 2018.

“I felt like a gun was held to our heads,” then-Mayor Clarke Conway recently recalled.

But Anthony Walker, chair of Brisbane’s Open Space & Ecology Committee, points out that the project is far from the older cottages and modest apartment buildings that line Brisbane’s quaint downtown. Bounded by Highway 101 to the east, and Bayshore Boulevard to the west and south, the Baylands would feel like its own district.

“It’s possible for us to have the best of both worlds,” Walker said. “We can have modern conveniences while still holding onto what makes Brisbane special.”

In recent years, as some Brisbane residents continued to voice concerns about town character and environmental contamination, Baylands supporters often heard little more than delay tactics.

Jonathan Scharfman, who served as general manager for the development group behind the Baylands from 2005 to 2019, notes that San Francisco’s Mission Bay was also once an old rail yard requiring extensive cleanup. Today, it’s a fast-rising neighborhood of life-science campuses, office space, retail and housing.

“The Baylands will have the opportunity to grow thoughtfully,” Scharfman said. “People need to keep in mind that all of this will occur gradually over many years.”


 
Brisbane is next to SF. This area is a former industrial site but people in the City, led by the now 91 year old former Mayor, have been fighting tooth and nail against building housing here for decades because they don't want their City to change.

It's the ultimate fvck you I've got mine attitude and a prime example of why housing is so expensive in California. Wonder how much racism is playing a role in this.

​

A suburb bordering S.F. lost control over housing development. What happens next?​


A couple of decades from now, if developers have their way, Caltrain riders leaving Bayshore station will look out over a new carbon-neutral neighborhood of apartment buildings, tree-lined streets and plazas. But as former Brisbane Mayor Ray Miller clutched his cane at that little-used stop on a recent afternoon, he was pleased to see only towering weeds, rusting fences and a grassy mound where one of the Bay Area’s largest garbage dumps once sat.

“What makes me angry,” he said, “is thinking about what this place might become.”

Miller, 91, is hardly alone. For the past 21 years, he and many other Brisbane residents have opposed efforts to transform the roughly 680-acre former industrial site straddling the San Francisco border into a mixed-use development with thousands of homes. They fear the proposed Baylands project, which could more than double the population of their hillside suburb, would threaten Brisbane’s small-town character while posing serious long-term environmental and health risks.

Yet as California’s housing crisis has worsened, state officials have become less willing to accept those concerns as justification for blocking more homes. In July, after Brisbane repeatedly missed deadlines to approve a plan for up to 2,200 homes on the Baylands site that would cover 81% of its state-mandated housing allocation, California ruled the city out of compliance with state housing laws.

That puts Brisbane at risk of civil penalties, a lawsuit or the loss of state funding if it doesn’t adopt the plan. Now, as housing advocates wait to see what Brisbane does next, this community of 4,700 residents just south of San Francisco finds itself at the center of a heated statewide debate: Can California’s increasingly aggressive enforcement of housing laws accomplish what years of planning mandates couldn’t?

“It’s pretty ironic when you think about it,” said Jeremy Levine, policy manager for the Housing Leadership Council of San Mateo County, which has worked to educate Brisbane residents on the Baylands project. “This community was so determined to protect what makes it special that it actually ended up with less control over its future.”

Most California cities are well behind on their state-mandated housing targets. But of the dozen or so that the state has deemed noncompliant, none matters more to the Bay Area housing shortage than Brisbane. The Baylands site, with its sprawling acreage near Highway 101, public transit and major employment centers in San Francisco and Silicon Valley, could make a significant dent in one of the nation’s most severe regional job-housing imbalances.


Pressure has been building in Brisbane, where the median home sale price more than doubled to $1.3 million in 2022 from $597,500 in 2012, according to the city’s housing plan. For young people who grew up here, the prospect of staying — or coming back — can feel out of reach.

“I think I’m going to pursue a career in tech sales, just because I hope to afford a house in my hometown someday,” said Sebastian Bousquet, an 18-year-old Brisbane native now attending the University of San Diego. “I want to have a family, and give my kids a childhood like the one I had, which will probably cost a lot of money.”

Nearly eight years after Brisbane voters approved housing plans for the Baylands site, city leaders have yet to adopt the zoning needed to build them. The city’s Planning Commission voted unanimously last month to recommend the City Council finally adopt the plan. Last Thursday, the council scheduled a final vote in October, setting up a test of whether California can compel local officials to approve housing.

“What’s happening in Brisbane really is a fascinating case study for this new approach the state has taken with its housing laws,” said Christopher Elmendorf, a law professor at UC Davis who’s a leading authority on California housing law. “A lot of eyes will be on those city council meetings.”
Brisbane has long attracted outsize attention on housing-related issues. For decades, developers have eyed the Baylands’ vast expanse of dry grass, weeds, dirt and gravel for its real estate potential.

The official Baylands development website reads like an urbanist fever dream for sustainable living: A massive solar farm. An on-site fleet of electric cars for residents. Zero carbon footprint. But to many current Brisbane residents, those renderings of futuristic streetscapes might feel borderline delusional.

The Baylands site was once where San Francisco dumped its garbage and Southern Pacific railroad repaired its trains. Cleaning up the lingering contamination will likely require at least hundreds of millions of dollars and three years of soil work.

“The whole thing is just ridiculous,” said Miller, a retired San Francisco State professor with a white beard. “They used to burn tires over there. You don’t mess with that.”

Miller and his wife, Anja, bought their yellow two-story house in Brisbane for $25,000 in 1967, the same year the landfill closed. They grew to love their small town, which owes its “City of Stars” nickname to an annual holiday ritual in which locals hang huge illuminated stars on their homes. At a downtown park, fire hydrants are painted in bright colors, then later retired to the town’s tiny hydrant graveyard.

The couple entered local politics, each serving on city council and as mayor. Miller was on the City Council in 1980 when, after years of fighting a massive development project on San Bruno Mountain, the city helped convince the federal government to declare the mountain critical habitat for the endangered callippe silverspot butterfly. Nine years later, as mayor, he helped negotiate a settlement with a developer — who sued him personally — to scale back another proposed development on the mountain.

But nothing could prepare Brisbane for the battle over the Baylands.

The saga began in 2004, when development group Universal Paragon Corp. applied to build 1 million square feet of commercial and retail space on the old landfill. The proposal called for shopping centers, offices, auto dealerships and hotels — but not housing, which the developer said was incompatible with the site’s contamination.

The plan evolved over the years as environmental studies and cleanup proposals developed, and demand for housing grew. By 2010, the proposal called for about 4,400 homes, mostly concentrated in the northwest corner of the Baylands site, away from the old landfill.

As neighbors aired their opposition to the project, housing activists cast Brisbane as a poster child for the NIMBY movement. Early in the city’s negotiations with Baylands developers, for example, a City Council member had even suggested skirting a state law that requires cities to plan for new housing — by zoning for homes at the bottom of the Brisbane lagoon.

In 2016, the City Council was still pushing for a Baylands plan devoted entirely to retail when a quote from Mayor Cliff Lentz published in the Chronicle went viral: “We’ll provide the commercial — S.F. will provide the housing.” To pro-housing activists, the quip captured their mounting frustration with the limits of local control over sprawling housing projects.

Proposition 13 — the 1978 California law that caps property-tax rates and limits increases in assessed property value — created a powerful incentive for cities to favor commercial development over housing. And that’s not even accounting for what author Jennifer Mapes, who has written extensively about small-town development, calls the “charm factor.”

Brisbane residents take immense pride in their 3-square-mile community’s slightly eclectic, self-contained civic culture. “In a place like that, tradition really matters,” Mapes said. “When faced with the prospect of such expansive growth, it’s almost natural for people to kind of freak out.”

In late 2017, desperate to push the project forward after more than a decade with minimal progress, the California legislature threatened to strip Brisbane of its control over the Baylands if it didn’t approve thousands of homes. Left with little choice, the City Council introduced a ballot measure that offered a compromise: 2,200 housing units.

It narrowly passed in November 2018.

“I felt like a gun was held to our heads,” then-Mayor Clarke Conway recently recalled.

But Anthony Walker, chair of Brisbane’s Open Space & Ecology Committee, points out that the project is far from the older cottages and modest apartment buildings that line Brisbane’s quaint downtown. Bounded by Highway 101 to the east, and Bayshore Boulevard to the west and south, the Baylands would feel like its own district.

“It’s possible for us to have the best of both worlds,” Walker said. “We can have modern conveniences while still holding onto what makes Brisbane special.”

In recent years, as some Brisbane residents continued to voice concerns about town character and environmental contamination, Baylands supporters often heard little more than delay tactics.

Jonathan Scharfman, who served as general manager for the development group behind the Baylands from 2005 to 2019, notes that San Francisco’s Mission Bay was also once an old rail yard requiring extensive cleanup. Today, it’s a fast-rising neighborhood of life-science campuses, office space, retail and housing.

“The Baylands will have the opportunity to grow thoughtfully,” Scharfman said. “People need to keep in mind that all of this will occur gradually over many years.”


I saw the length and was intrigued, but it turned out to be an elaboration of your earlier posts.

We've done this dance Wack, and it's the same outcome. You're just stubbornly insisting on something that does not overshadow, diminish or usurp the OP or my responses to you. I'm done here, and will leave the chronology of the posts for the readers to judge. POSTS # 9, 16, 90. 96, 203, 110, 125, 127, 136.
 
JPP has been host to a plethora of folk who have their own versions of America's congenital racism .... mostly denial if not out right attempts at justification.

Well, I came across this on FaceBook, and just couldn't resist throwing some HISTORICAL FACTS into the conversation (facts being akin to sunlight to a vampire for the aforementioned folks). The reactions are going to range from predictable to the absurd, but (God forgive me) I just couldn't resist. Enjoy! ;)


View: https://youtu.be/ETR9qrVS17g?si=IJtWjWcNbA_h-0Ul

Oh dear. You hurt the racist MAGATs' feelz. It'll be fun to see if th ey blame FDR(D) for redlining. lol
 
I saw the length and was intrigued, but it turned out to be an elaboration of your earlier posts.

We've done this dance Wack, and it's the same outcome. You're just stubbornly insisting on something that does not overshadow, diminish or usurp the OP or my responses to you. I'm done here, and will leave the chronology of the posts for the readers to judge. POSTS # 9, 16, 90. 96, 203, 110, 125, 127, 136.
I'm not trying to belabor the argument but I haven't in any way denied the history here. To understand what's happening today in stories like the one above, we need to know the history. It's important.

Most people don't and that transcends race, gender and political beliefs. Most people buy a home and they like their neighborhood and they don't want to see it change and they don't want more traffic. That drives most of this NIMBYism.

And even people who know the history of exclusionary zoning and speak out against it, are still NIMBYs because "home is where the heart is" and for most us our home is the biggest investment we make. And that latter portion trumps all else.
 
The exchanges have been both predictable and fascinating.
Here's one of the recent books I've read. It's saying we've moved from raw racism to more class based discrimination in housing. Not saying you should buy this, but it was a good read (at least to someone like me who gets passionate about this stuff).

Excluded: How Snob Zoning, NIMBYism, and Class Bias Build the Walls We Don't See​


 
Here's one of the recent books I've read. It's saying we've moved from raw racism to more class based discrimination in housing. Not saying you should buy this, but it was a good read (at least to someone like me who gets passionate about this stuff).

Excluded: How Snob Zoning, NIMBYism, and Class Bias Build the Walls We Don't See​


But leave us not forget (again):


But hope springs eternal


Bottom line. Its going to take a LONG time to undo the damage done to black folk via the discriminatory actions of the GI Bill and decades of red lining/bias zoning laws. Case in point Levittown is SLOWLY integrating.
 
JPP has endured hosts of leftists mindlessly screaming RACISM! from every corner about everything from ice cream to construction equipment. Nothing they say is ever anything but incoherent raving.

Well, then it must be prophecy from on high. You had me at "Facebook."


Spoiler Alert: The video is one of virtue-signaling Caucasians confessing how racist they are for living where there are other "white" people. The high numbers of "white" people living in suburban communities is no accident; it is the direct result of RACIST! federal policies. The makers of the video swapped Cause with Effect. The video is stupid.
We don’t need to listen to you racists on this subject

You are a fucking racist, so to you nothing is racist



You are disqualified from the discussion on what is racism


Just like pedophiles are disqualified to help society to define what is child molestation

You are the problem

You are incapable of being part of the solution
 
But leave us not forget (again):


But hope springs eternal


Bottom line. Its going to take a LONG time to undo the damage done to black folk via the discriminatory actions of the GI Bill and decades of red lining/bias zoning laws. Case in point Levittown is SLOWLY integrating.
For my understanding, you're talking about specifically black people here right? Because if we're talking just white and black, and black people on the average make less money, then they are absolutely harmed by exclusionary zoning.

If we're talking just non white people, Asians and Indians make more money than white people. They can live where ever they want.

With the increased diversity of the country today, it turns the argument more into class than race. That's not to deny the history that happened to black people, or say it has no affect on them today. But it's not 1960 in terms of being just black and white.
 
If you've ever been to the East Bay you may be familiar with College Ave. It starts in an upscale neighborhood in Oakland and runs through Berkeley and next to the Cal campus.

There's a proposal for two senior living towers on the street that would provide much needed housing (this would be in Oakland).

Needless to say the NIMBYs are out in full force fighting against this one. This column is from our local progressive political writer and I was pretty surprised he said this:


The burgeoning battle over a proposal to build 415 units on the site of a popular Trader Joe’s in Oakland’s Rockridge neighborhood is a cautionary tale about what Gov. Gavin Newsom has called California’s “original sin” — its failure for decades to build enough housing, which has created a crippling affordability crisis.

Rockridge, the North Oakland neighborhood where the average home price is $1.8 million, was long a poster child for NIMBYism. Even though 89% of Wicks’ district voted for Kamala Harris in 2024, and signs in front of many homes virtue-signal that “In this house, we believe in science” and “Black Lives Matter,” there is almost no affordable housing, and neighbors have long swatted away anything that violates the height limits along its College Avenue commercial corridor.

But now, the NIMBY chickens have come home to roost. And in the case of Rockridge, it will likely have to choke down two massive towers that are out of scale with the three- and four-story buildings that line College Avenue. Perhaps more important to many residents: They could lose their beloved Trader Joe’s.



On the surface these aren't the kind of people you would think of as being racist. But racism can come in many, often subtle, forms. How much would you attribute this battle to racism?
Why would anyone want to live in Oakland?
 
I saw the length and was intrigued, but it turned out to be an elaboration of your earlier posts.

We've done this dance Wack, and it's the same outcome. You're just stubbornly insisting on something that does not overshadow, diminish or usurp the OP or my responses to you. I'm done here, and will leave the chronology of the posts for the readers to judge. POSTS # 9, 16, 90. 96, 203, 110, 125, 127, 136.
Okay. I have judged. These posts, and others, show you are racist, that you just make up shit, and you are a pretender.
 
But leave us not forget (again):

But hope springs eternal

Bottom line. Its going to take a LONG time to undo the damage done to black folk via the discriminatory actions of the GI Bill and decades of red lining/bias zoning laws. Case in point Levittown is SLOWLY integrating.
Racism.
 
We don’t need to listen to you racists on this subject
Inversion fallacy. You can't blame your racism on anybody else.
You are a fucking racist, so to you nothing is racist
Inversion fallacy.
You are disqualified from the discussion on what is racism
You aren't having a discussion.
Just like pedophiles are disqualified to help society to define what is child molestation
Random phrase ignored.
You are the problem

You are incapable of being part of the solution
Void argument fallacy.
 
For my understanding, you're talking about specifically black people here right? Because if we're talking just white and black, and black people on the average make less money, then they are absolutely harmed by exclusionary zoning.

If we're talking just non white people, Asians and Indians make more money than white people. They can live where ever they want.

With the increased diversity of the country today, it turns the argument more into class than race. That's not to deny the history that happened to black people, or say it has no affect on them today. But it's not 1960 in terms of being just black and white.
Excuse me but what the hell do you think the OP was about?

Red lining was created for the express purpose of keeping predominantly black folk (and other minorities) from certain areas . .REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THEY HAD THE MONEY OR THE EXACT SAME CREDIT RISK as white folk. A matter of history, a matter of fact. In fact, a form of this was addressed in the 1970's CRA ACT by Pres. Carter. It made sure that banks gave black folk the same loan consideration as white folk.

So you very first paragraph is totally incorrect, thus discrediting the rest of your post.

That's it. Wack. This post in conjunction with post #148 ends this assertion of yours. You can have the last predictable response.
 
Okay. I have judged. These posts, and others, show you are racist, that you just make up shit, and you are a pretender.
You always make the same accusations, but when put on the spot to explain EXACTLY what someone says or links fits your accusation, you just blow smoke with dodgy BS an ad hominem attacks ... typical maga/alt-right tactic. Just like you'll do in your next response.
 
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